This is why some are masters, and some are dabblers, folks.a buffalo head because there is a sadness to the way they look, the crest of a gorilla because their brows express so much emotion, the muzzle of a boar, the mane of a lion so he is soft if Belle hugs him, twisted horns, cow ears to make him seem friendlier, and human eyes since there is a prince trapped inside of Beast and his eyes are the window to his soul.
Jab’s Builds! (Beaker! Sam Eagle! Miss Piggy! The Swedish Chef!)
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
OMG, this bit on Glen Keane's stuff being at the Disney Museum! Totally wish I could go there! So many cool tidbits of information in this (I actually didn't make the Bil/Glen Keane connection; and the reasoning behind the Beast's appearance is fantastic): http://micechat.com/189288-walt-disney- ... len-keane/
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
Plus, I mean, it's in SPACE! There's no gravity in space, so they probably weight less, right? PHYSICS!!!Batgirl III wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:57 am The moon's mass is 7.35 x 10^22 kg, which is very roughly 81,000,000,000,000,000,000 US tons... and Earth's moon is on the small side as celestial bodies go. Probably easiest just to hand-wave planet-moving shenanigans as a Plot Device and leave it be.
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
The class Disney films — live action and animated —are masters at getting this sort of “buy in” from the audience. We want to suspend our disbelief and escape into their world, we just need a little help from the filmmaker to do so. Almost all Disney films give us just enough of a sense of normalcy before they spring the fantastic on us, we don’t start out in Wonderland... We’re in a pleasant meadow being bored by our big sister, then we spot a rabbit in a waistcoat, and then we’re down the rabbit hole.The fear instilled in him by Cruella de Vil gave him a reason to believe that she was real; he emphasized that a child only needs a little reason to believe and they will be hooked.
Too many bad films and stories forget this. They rush into getting us into the “good stuff” that they neglect the set-up. Compare and contrast the Gene Wilder Willy Wonka & the Chocolate Factory with the abysmal Johnny Depp Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. The newer film neglects to establish the normalcy and rushed into the fantastic. We don’t suspend our disbelief.
There’s a lesson to be learned here for Game Masters, I think.
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
That’s why explosions in space operas are so loud. No pesky atmosphere to get in the way of the sound waves!Jabroniville wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 7:54 amPlus, I mean, it's in SPACE! There's no gravity in space, so they probably weight less, right? PHYSICS!!!Batgirl III wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:57 am The moon's mass is 7.35 x 10^22 kg, which is very roughly 81,000,000,000,000,000,000 US tons... and Earth's moon is on the small side as celestial bodies go. Probably easiest just to hand-wave planet-moving shenanigans as a Plot Device and leave it be.
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
Honestly, you'd only really need 83 lifting strength, which would give you around 1 x 10^23 tons, around sixteen times the mass of the Earth, to move basically any solid celestial object. Beyond that you'd be dealing with objects that would not be counted as solid in any real way, such as gas giants and stars. A considerable portion of that could be in an array keyed off of strength damage.Batgirl III wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 8:08 amThat’s why explosions in space operas are so loud. No pesky atmosphere to get in the way of the sound waves!Jabroniville wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 7:54 amPlus, I mean, it's in SPACE! There's no gravity in space, so they probably weight less, right? PHYSICS!!!Batgirl III wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:57 am The moon's mass is 7.35 x 10^22 kg, which is very roughly 81,000,000,000,000,000,000 US tons... and Earth's moon is on the small side as celestial bodies go. Probably easiest just to hand-wave planet-moving shenanigans as a Plot Device and leave it be.
The exponential progression's really useful sometimes.
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
Well when you look at the physics of it......WTF... Batgirl's back?
Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
Hey, Batgirl III is back! Welcome back!
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
You’re forgetting about extrasolar planets, several of which are thought to be terrestrial (a.k.a., solid rock) and are several times the mass of the Earth. Of course, even if those real world exoplanets turn out to be gaseous, in the universes of comic books there most definitely are solid objects bigger than the Earth... or even the Sun.
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Re: Superboy
Ken wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:34 amOne might also add AE: "Planetoid-lifting Strength": Power Lifting 45 (45)Jabroniville wrote: ↑Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:05 pm SUPERBOY (Clark Kent, aka Kal-El) J
PL 15 (335)
STRENGTH 18 STAMINA 16 AGILITY 3
FIGHTING 9 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 4 PRESENCE 4
"More Powerful Than a Speeding Locomotive" Power-Lifting 7 (500,000 tons) [7]
"Heat Beam" Damage 15 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Line +2) (45) -- [50]"Faster Than a Speeding Bullet"
- AE: "Heat Vision" Blast 16 (Feats: Extended Reach 2) (34)
- AE: "Freeze Breath" Affliction 14 (Strength; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless/Paralyzed) (Extras: Ranged, Extra Condition) (42)
- AE: "Freeze Cone" Affliction 14 (Strength; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless/Paralyzed) (Extras: Area- 60ft. Cone, Extra Condition) (42)
- AE: "Ground Pound" Affliction 14 (Strength/Athletics; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless) (Extras: Area- 120ft. Burst +3, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Limited Degree, Both Must Be Grounded, Instant Recovery) (28)
- AE: "Super-Breath" Affliction 14 (Strength/Athletics; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless) (Extras: Area- 120ft. Cone +2, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Limited Degree, Both Must Be Grounded, Instant Recovery) Linked to Move Object 11 (Extras: Area- 120ft. Cone +2) (Flaws: Touch Range) (36)
Flight 18 (500,000 mph) (Feats: Dynamic) (37) -- [41]Movement 1 (Space Travel 1) [2]
- Dynamic AE: Quickness 16 (Feats: Dynamic) (17)
- Dynamic AE: Speed 15 (64,000 mph) (Feats: Dynamic) (16)
That way one, with Extra-Effort, could get into Moon-sized lifting. I'd suggest power stunting off of his Sensory powers when he has to drag several planets around.
81,000,000,000,000,000,000 tons comes in at a STR 72.Batgirl III wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:57 am The moon's mass is 7.35 x 10^22 kg, which is very roughly 81,000,000,000,000,000,000 US tons... and Earth's moon is on the small side as celestial bodies go. Probably easiest just to hand-wave planet-moving shenanigans as a Plot Device and leave it be.
A base lifting STR of 25 plus the 45 power lifting I suggested would be a total of 70. That makes it close enough that Extra Effort.
I said one might add. Not should.
There's nothing wrong with hand waving it. But since Jab's build was left the points so that they were that close, I thought it deserved a mention.
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Ferro Lad
FERRO LAD (Andrew Nolan, aka Ferro)
Created By: Jim Shooter & Curt Swan
First Appearance: Adventure Comics #346 (July 1966)
Home Planet: Earth
Origin of Powers: Mutation
Eras: Original & Reboot
Relationships: None
Role: Sacrificial Buddy, Powerhouse, Ugly Hero
PL 10 (124)
STRENGTH 2/11 STAMINA 5 AGILITY 1
FIGHTING 7 DEXTERITY 2
INTELLIGENCE 0 AWARENESS 1 PRESENCE 1
Skills:
Expertise (Space Hero) 4 (+4)
Insight 2 (+3)
Perception 4 (+5)
Persuasion 4 (+4)
Vehicles 2 (+4)
Advantages:
Equipment 10 (Legion Gear), Interpose, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 3
Powers:
"Iron Body" (Action -1) [-1]
Enhanced Strength 9 [18]
Protection 8 (Extras: Impervious 15) [23]
Features 2: Increased Mass 2 [2]
Immunity 10 (Life Support) [10]
Equipment:
"Legion Gear"
"Telepathic Ear Plug" Comprehend 3 (Languages) (6)
"Legion Flight Ring"
Flight 7 (250 mph) (14)
Immunity 7 (Hot, Cold, Vacuum, Pressure, Radiation, Suffocation 2) (7)
Movement 1 (Space Travel 1) (2)
Communication 5 (Flaws: Fifth Rank is only towards Legionnaires) (18)
Offense:
Unarmed +7 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Iron Body +7 (+11 Damage, DC 26)
Initiative +1
Defenses:
Dodge +7 (DC 17), Parry +7 (DC 17), Toughness +5 (+13 Iron Form, +8 Impervious), Fortitude +5, Will +6
Complications:
Shame (Deformity)- Andrew Nolan always wears a mask, to hide his facial deformity.
Relationship (Douglas Nolan)- Andrew has a twin brother with the same abilities and deformity.
Total: Abilities: 38 / Skills: 16--8 / Advantages: 15 / Powers: 52 / Defenses: 11 (124)
Ferro Lad- The Legion's Sacrifice:
-Ferro Lad is one of those little hints that the Legion series, in spite of it's goofiness, was a little more serious than many other books at the time. Where else could a team book actually have a character DIE in one of his first missions? This was pretty much brand new stuff for comics at the time (I mean, a SUPER-HERO... DYING?), and was done very well, showing Ferro Lad knock out Superboy himself and fly a bomb into the heart of a Sun-Eater, sacrificing his life to save the entire universe. This gave the goofy-named kid in the terrible costume (I mean... "Fe" on the front? At least the Metal Men had COOL symbols to use) a lifelong credibility he would never have gained otherwise, and he became a Legion legend for it. And he coulda been black, but Mort Weisinger (who I would bet money is a racist) forced Shooter to change it, saying "We'd lose our distribution in the South." Ah, THE SOUTH. And because Shooter couldn't do what he wanted with the guy, he chose him for his "Someone should die in this story" situation.
-Ferro Lad thus stuck out as a great sacrifice and a true hero- his fellow recruits were Princess Projectra, Karate Kid & Nemesis Kid- the latter of which turned out to be evil. It was very soon into his run that he died, and he would be referred to a great deal afterwards. He was "brought back" in a manner of speaking near the end of the first continuity as one of the "SW6" clones. Since the clone was created very shortly before Ferro Lad's death, this was in essence a resurrection of the same character (now called "Ferro"), but the book ended not to long afterwards.
Reboot:
-The Post-Zero Hour team featured a "Dorky Younger Guy" type Ferro, which I thought was a rather brilliant move. His death was a legendary moment in LOSH history, but if you've got an all-new continuity to play with, why NOT break out one of the old toys that went un-used? I mean, you're not gonna replicate the exact same story anyways, right? And that he was mostly known for DYING means you can constantly have his death hanging over the book. And it's kinda neat to give people a look at a guy who never really got his chance to be a regular character.
-In this version, Ferro was the son of a 20th Century actress who'd abandoned her children for their grotesque facial deformities. An unscrupulous scientist raised them, but Andrew left for the Legion (who were in the past at the time), becoming one of their early members. He befriended Karate Kid and was fused to his helmet for a while. He did not appear in the Threeboot continuity, nor did he return for the revival of the Silver Age group (since he was, rather famously, dead in that version).
Stats:
-Ferro Lad's a decent little character, but lacks both raw power and accuracy, and is so a PL 9 on offense, PL 10 on defense. He was always one of the weaker Legionnaires when he was kicking around, and only KOed a weakened Superboy once. He's still very strong and quite hard to hurt, but he's not scaring any serious villains. this build probably better reflects the Reboot version, since the original one died fairly soon into his run.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Tue May 24, 2022 9:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Superboy
I love the math and seeing the Strength needed level 72!Ken wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:05 pmKen wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:34 amOne might also add AE: "Planetoid-lifting Strength": Power Lifting 45 (45)Jabroniville wrote: ↑Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:05 pm SUPERBOY (Clark Kent, aka Kal-El) J
PL 15 (335)
STRENGTH 18 STAMINA 16 AGILITY 3
FIGHTING 9 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 4 PRESENCE 4
"More Powerful Than a Speeding Locomotive" Power-Lifting 7 (500,000 tons) [7]
"Heat Beam" Damage 15 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Line +2) (45) -- [50]"Faster Than a Speeding Bullet"
- AE: "Heat Vision" Blast 16 (Feats: Extended Reach 2) (34)
- AE: "Freeze Breath" Affliction 14 (Strength; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless/Paralyzed) (Extras: Ranged, Extra Condition) (42)
- AE: "Freeze Cone" Affliction 14 (Strength; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless/Paralyzed) (Extras: Area- 60ft. Cone, Extra Condition) (42)
- AE: "Ground Pound" Affliction 14 (Strength/Athletics; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless) (Extras: Area- 120ft. Burst +3, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Limited Degree, Both Must Be Grounded, Instant Recovery) (28)
- AE: "Super-Breath" Affliction 14 (Strength/Athletics; Hindered & Vulnerable/Stunned & Defenseless) (Extras: Area- 120ft. Cone +2, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Limited Degree, Both Must Be Grounded, Instant Recovery) Linked to Move Object 11 (Extras: Area- 120ft. Cone +2) (Flaws: Touch Range) (36)
Flight 18 (500,000 mph) (Feats: Dynamic) (37) -- [41]Movement 1 (Space Travel 1) [2]
- Dynamic AE: Quickness 16 (Feats: Dynamic) (17)
- Dynamic AE: Speed 15 (64,000 mph) (Feats: Dynamic) (16)
That way one, with Extra-Effort, could get into Moon-sized lifting. I'd suggest power stunting off of his Sensory powers when he has to drag several planets around.81,000,000,000,000,000,000 tons comes in at a STR 72.Batgirl III wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:57 am The moon's mass is 7.35 x 10^22 kg, which is very roughly 81,000,000,000,000,000,000 US tons... and Earth's moon is on the small side as celestial bodies go. Probably easiest just to hand-wave planet-moving shenanigans as a Plot Device and leave it be.
A base lifting STR of 25 plus the 45 power lifting I suggested would be a total of 70. That makes it close enough that Extra Effort.
I said one might add. Not should.
There's nothing wrong with hand waving it. But since Jab's build was left the points so that they were that close, I thought it deserved a mention.
Was Mon-El said to be as strong as Superboy, Supergirl or Superman? Did Mon-El ever do those planet-moving feats? What about Supergirl?
Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
Mon El never did that I recall though he was pretty well up there as a Daxamite
Also the superboy above is sitting at a solid 43 strength wise if you count his Flight as additional strength since hes adding the flight as thrust and momentum which is allowable under the rules in space.
Also the superboy above is sitting at a solid 43 strength wise if you count his Flight as additional strength since hes adding the flight as thrust and momentum which is allowable under the rules in space.
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
I already accounted for that. The largest rocky exoplanet I could find on a quick Google is around fourteen times the mass of the Earth. I accounted for that with the given rank of 83, given that the Earth would have a mass of rank 78-79, since that covers the largest known exoplanets.Batgirl III wrote: ↑Sun Apr 08, 2018 4:23 pm You’re forgetting about extrasolar planets, several of which are thought to be terrestrial (a.k.a., solid rock) and are several times the mass of the Earth. Of course, even if those real world exoplanets turn out to be gaseous, in the universes of comic books there most definitely are solid objects bigger than the Earth... or even the Sun.
Of course, if you wanted to make it really fun and ridiculous, you could figure out for instance the volume of the known universe, and the density of the heaviest known substance, to figure out how much strength someone like Superman would need to lift a universe-sized object made of the stuff. We know that osmium for instance, the densest metal, comes in at 22.5 tons per cubic metre. We also know that the observable universe has a volume of 3.58x10^80 cubic metres.
Running the numbers, that gives us approximately 8.055x10^81 metric tons. We can figure that out pretty easily. With an approximate STR 269, you could lift an object of 1.25x10^82 metric tons, which is more than enough to cover basically any object in comic-books. Certainly it would cover all mass in the known universe many, many times over.
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
Well we know he has a key made of solid Dwarf star alloy that weights several millions of tons for the Fortress main gates.
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Re: Jab's Builds! (Havok! Legion of Super-Heroes! Chameleon Boy!)
So... what’s Kismet’s Strength bonus / Grapple check? I want to build a Superman that can suplex the universe!
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