Jab’s Builds! (Lawnmower Man! Samus Aran! Metroids!)

[Jabroniville]

(I've really come around to liking Miles as The Scarlet Spider).

Wait a second, where did that come from?

Ares does edits of superhero costumes. He shared that one on the Echoes Discord recently .

[marcoasalazarm]

Need a link to that one. An invite. Man, you just made me so much more interested that my sleep just went away.

[drkrash]

I really, really want to love Mockingbird, because she's totally my type of character (I'm a sucker for the acrobatic lady spy). I did not like her old costume, but the versions from the 2000s were pretty great.

However, since her re-appearance in Secret Invasion, *almost* everything I read her in portrayed her as an arrogant bitch. This was especially evident with the mini-series with Hawkeye, where she and Dominic Fortune had to be cooler-than-thou, while Hawkeye was just trying to play nice with them. Hated it.

But there were two exceptions. During (I think) Fear Itself, she had to have a transfusion of the infinity formula (again, I think?) and she had a period of self-doubt where she wondered if she was worthy of playing in the big leagues as a "superhero." I liked that a lot.

Also, much later on, she was working with/for Peter Parker and they sort of started dating. Even though I'll always be Team MJ, I would have liked to have seen this go a little further than it ever did (ditto for Carol Danvers and Peter).

[Ken]

Mark Gruenwald said in an interview about the Squadron Supreme, "I'm not going to do much with the Golden Archer and Lady Lark relationship, because I already did it with Hawkeye and Mockingbird in the Hawkeye limited series." Of course, Golden Archer and Lady Lark were the SS stand-ins for Green Arrow and Black Canary.

[marcoasalazarm]

My top (hateful) example is her appearance in "Silk". So she gets Cindy Moon to play infiltrator in Black Cat's gang, then she sees Cindy Moon starting to steal stuff around New York, and she unhesitatingly arrests Silk while pooh-pooh-ing Cindy's explanation that it was an evil her from an alternate dimension and says it's obviously Cindy being drawn to the dark side courtesy of Black Cat...

...you'd think someone who spent the better part of an unknown amount of in-universe years being replaced by a Skrull would at least ask Cindy if there's some way she can prove that it wasn't her and THEN pooh-pooh Cindy when she says she can't, but nope, ever since Civil War it seems anybody who has ever worked for SHIELD gets an INT penalty in the triple digits (before that, it was only double digits) when they are working in the name of the law.

[Shock]

Funny thing about "it was a skull": Bobbi was actually shown multiple times to be in Hell during the time when she was dead. Both she and Patsy Walker were in the Arena of Tainted Souls forced to fight continuously. Hawkeye and the Thunderbolts went into Hell to try to rescue Bobbi but were tricked by Damien Hellstrom into rescuing Patsy instead.

Then in a Hellcat miniseries, Patsy is back in Hell foiling a Mephisto plot and at the end tries to bring Bobbi back with her but she mysteriously refuses to go saying "I'm here for a reason."

[Ares]

Funny thing about "it was a skull": Bobbi was actually shown multiple times to be in Hell during the time when she was dead. Both she and Patsy Walker were in the Arena of Tainted Souls forced to fight continuously. Hawkeye and the Thunderbolts went into Hell to try to rescue Bobbi but were tricked by Damien Hellstrom into rescuing Patsy instead.

Then in a Hellcat miniseries, Patsy is back in Hell foiling a Mephisto plot and at the end tries to bring Bobbi back with her but she mysteriously refuses to go saying "I'm here for a reason."

20, even 15 years ago, we would have gotten a story about them bringing Bobbi back, even some explanation to the dangling plot seeds left by other writers. A lot of modern writers can't keep their own continuity straight, they aren't going to care about things like that. The biggest explanation we'd probably get was a hand wave and "Mephisto was f***ing with them".

Frankly, I'd use that as an excuse to retcon most of what's happened with Bobbi as the Phantom Rider messing with her. Turns out it was Bobbi that died way back when and the Phantom Rider brought her body back without her soul, which is in Hell for some reason. Her personality change and attitude are a result of the Rider trying to make her more of his ideal woman, which is why the current Bobby thinks she willingly cheated on Clint rather than was raped.

I might even take it a step further and use this as an explanation for why Clint has sucked since Bobbi has returned. The Phantom Rider needed a powerful force to bring Bobbi's body back to life, but he himself didn't have the raw emotion for it. Clint tho? Clint was still in love with her, still missed her terribly, and his emotions always ran strong. So the Phantom rider basically has been siphoning off Clint's emotional and spiritual energy to power the spell keeping Bobbi alive. It's why Clint is such a screw up these days, it's why he's suddenly someone who cheats on the women in his life, it's why he's much less "in your face" and confident than he use to be. A good chunk of his soul is being used to power Bobbi's corpse and it's slowly killing him. It's also why Clint no longer wears his old outfit: he subconsciously feels unworthy of it.

Naturally this revelation would lead Clint and Bobbi on a quest into Hell to get her soul back, some hashing out of their issues, and we learn that Bobbi has been in Hell doing something important that pays off when they escape. Bobbi and Clint are both restored to who they were, they both wear versions of their classic outfits, and they get re-married at the end of the story in a homage to the original mini-series that got them together.

And if I'm feeling REALLY in the mood, the thing Mockingbird was doing in Hell? She'd learned Mephisto was after something, playing a long game in his quest to eradicate love, and was waiting for the chance to steal this great source of love to power something terrible. What Bobbi eventually sees Mephisto do is steal a source of love from two people that gives him power over time and space. That thing in question? Peter and MJ's marriage.

A few years ago, Bobbi actually managed to steal the contract with Peter and MJ's marriage, which is why Peter and MJ have been getting back together recently. When the heroes return, not only do Clint and Bobbi get back together, but so do Peter and MJ. They also learn that Aunt May would have actually survived the whole contrived convenience, and that was Mephisto having Mysterio pull a fast on them to let Beck earn off some of his time in Hell. And in the end, Peter and MJ rip up the contract together, their marriage is re-established and they have a nice moment where they renew their vows to each other.

This started out as a Clint/Bobbi story, but now I think it'd make a cool Hawkeye/Mockingbird/Spider-Man story, especially since Peter and Bobbi briefly dated. Have the other Avengers help them out, but make it largely about Clint, Bobbi and Peter sticking it to the devil, and giving a middle finger to both Joe Q and Chelsea Cain.

I'd call it "Spider-Man, Hawkeye, Mockingbird: Love Conquers All".

[Ares]

(I've really come around to liking Miles as The Scarlet Spider).

Wait a second, where did that come from?

Ares does edits of superhero costumes. He shared that one on the Echoes Discord recently .

Need a link to that one. An invite. Man, you just made me so much more interested that my sleep just went away.

Glad you found the way to our Discord! And if you're curious, I've got two edit threads on the board.

One based on Ronnie Thunderbolt's art: https://www.echoesofthemultiverse.com/v ... 999#p17999

And one that's just various edits: https://www.echoesofthemultiverse.com/v ... 95#p106995

[Woodclaw]

Funny thing about "it was a skull": Bobbi was actually shown multiple times to be in Hell during the time when she was dead. Both she and Patsy Walker were in the Arena of Tainted Souls forced to fight continuously. Hawkeye and the Thunderbolts went into Hell to try to rescue Bobbi but were tricked by Damien Hellstrom into rescuing Patsy instead.

Then in a Hellcat miniseries, Patsy is back in Hell foiling a Mephisto plot and at the end tries to bring Bobbi back with her but she mysteriously refuses to go saying "I'm here for a reason."

20, even 15 years ago, we would have gotten a story about them bringing Bobbi back, even some explanation to the dangling plot seeds left by other writers. A lot of modern writers can't keep their own continuity straight, they aren't going to care about things like that. The biggest explanation we'd probably get was a hand wave and "Mephisto was f***ing with them".

Frankly, I'd use that as an excuse to retcon most of what's happened with Bobbi as the Phantom Rider messing with her. Turns out it was Bobbi that died way back when and the Phantom Rider brought her body back without her soul, which is in Hell for some reason. Her personality change and attitude are a result of the Rider trying to make her more of his ideal woman, which is why the current Bobby thinks she willingly cheated on Clint rather than was raped.

I might even take it a step further and use this as an explanation for why Clint has sucked since Bobbi has returned. The Phantom Rider needed a powerful force to bring Bobbi's body back to life, but he himself didn't have the raw emotion for it. Clint tho? Clint was still in love with her, still missed her terribly, and his emotions always ran strong. So the Phantom rider basically has been siphoning off Clint's emotional and spiritual energy to power the spell keeping Bobbi alive. It's why Clint is such a screw up these days, it's why he's suddenly someone who cheats on the women in his life, it's why he's much less "in your face" and confident than he use to be. A good chunk of his soul is being used to power Bobbi's corpse and it's slowly killing him. It's also why Clint no longer wears his old outfit: he subconsciously feels unworthy of it.

Naturally this revelation would lead Clint and Bobbi on a quest into Hell to get her soul back, some hashing out of their issues, and we learn that Bobbi has been in Hell doing something important that pays off when they escape. Bobbi and Clint are both restored to who they were, they both wear versions of their classic outfits, and they get re-married at the end of the story in a homage to the original mini-series that got them together.

And if I'm feeling REALLY in the mood, the thing Mockingbird was doing in Hell? She'd learned Mephisto was after something, playing a long game in his quest to eradicate love, and was waiting for the chance to steal this great source of love to power something terrible. What Bobbi eventually sees Mephisto do is steal a source of love from two people that gives him power over time and space. That thing in question? Peter and MJ's marriage.

A few years ago, Bobbi actually managed to steal the contract with Peter and MJ's marriage, which is why Peter and MJ have been getting back together recently. When the heroes return, not only do Clint and Bobbi get back together, but so do Peter and MJ. They also learn that Aunt May would have actually survived the whole contrived convenience, and that was Mephisto having Mysterio pull a fast on them to let Beck earn off some of his time in Hell. And in the end, Peter and MJ rip up the contract together, their marriage is re-established and they have a nice moment where they renew their vows to each other.

This started out as a Clint/Bobbi story, but now I think it'd make a cool Hawkeye/Mockingbird/Spider-Man story, especially since Peter and Bobbi briefly dated. Have the other Avengers help them out, but make it largely about Clint, Bobbi and Peter sticking it to the devil, and giving a middle finger to both Joe Q and Chelsea Cain.

I'd call it "Spider-Man, Hawkeye, Mockingbird: Love Conquers All".

I don't know if anyone would be able to do justice to this idea, but I would buy it.

[Ares]

I don't know if anyone would be able to do justice to this idea, but I would buy it.

Thanks! Give me a good co-writer and a solid artist and I'd give it my best shot.

[Jack of Spades]

Ares, when do you give up your day job and become a full-time fixit man for Marvel & DC?

[Ares]

Ares, when do you give up your day job and become a full-time fixit man for Marvel & DC?

When they make me an offer or I can somehow get my foot in the door. If I could get paid to fix the last 15 or so years of Marvel and DC mistakes, I'd jump on that in a heart beat. Lord knows I've got plenty of material to work with.

[Goldar]

Ares, when do you give up your day job and become a full-time fixit man for Marvel & DC?

When they make me an offer or I can somehow get my foot in the door. If I could get paid to fix the last 15 or so years of Marvel and DC mistakes, I'd jump on that in a heart beat. Lord knows I've got plenty of material to work with.

Last 15 years?? Hell, the last 35 years need to be fixed!!

(Yeah, I love ya man, but I'm gonna make ya work for that DC/Marvel salary! )

[Jabroniville]

LOL this panel is always hilarious to me.

BOBCAT (Real Name Unknown)
Created By: Tom DeFalco & Mark Bright
First Appearance: Solo Avengers #11 (1988)
Role: Jobber Villain
Group Affiliations: The Claws (his own personal gang)
PL 7 (98)
STRENGTH 2 STAMINA 3 AGILITY 4
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 0 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 2

Skills:
Acrobatics 6 (+10)
Athletics 6 (+8)
Close Combat (Unarmed) 1 (+11)
Deception 3 (+5)
Expertise (Criminal) 5 (+5)
Insight 2 (+4)
Intimidation 3 (+5)
Perception 3 (+5)
Stealth 3 (+7)

Advantages:
Defensive Attack, Defensive Roll, Equipment 2 (Bolas), Evasion, Fast Grab, Improved Critical 2 (Unarmed, Claws), Power Attack, Ranged Attack 4, Set-Up, Startle, Takedown, Teamwork

Powers:
"Bobcat Costume" (Flaws: Removable) [4]
"Claws"
Strength-Damage +2 (Feats: Split) (3)
Movement 1 (Wall-Crawling) (2)
-- (5 points)

Equipment:
"Bolas" Snare 5 (Flaws: Limited to 5 Uses) (Diminished Range -1) (9)

Offense:
Unarmed +11 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Claws +10 (+4 Damage, DC 19)
Bolas +8 (+5 Ranged Affliction, DC 15)
Initiative +4

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 20), Parry +10 (DC 20), Toughness +3 (+4 D.Roll), Fortitude +5, Will +3

Complications:
Motivation (Greed)

Total: Abilities: 54 / Skills: 32--16 / Advantages: 15 / Powers: 4 / Defenses: 9 (98)

-Bobcat is just another generic Jobber Villain, a guy wearing a simple suit, but for one thing: He's got a gang with him, ALL wearing identical costumes. That's actually a pretty cool trick for a Martial Artist guy, as it leaves the hero not knowing WHICH one is the master of the group, and the best fighter. Created just for "Solo Avengers", a book made so that Hawkeye had a solo platform (he was one of the most popular Avengers, but never able to carry his own book) that could be shared with others in the large Avengers roster (West & East Coasts), he confounded the archer once and that was it. Pretty much your standard one-shot Marvel Two-In-One/Team-Up or Solo Avengers villain in that regard- most were abysmally terrible or created with no thought for a thrown-together issue.

-Bobcat's a good fighter, but an abysmally-weak villain, like most one-shots are. Scourge missed out on a PRIME target with this dude, a PL 7 martial artist, enough to bother Hawkeye for a bit (especially with his goons), but not enought to last.

THE CLAWS- Bobcat's Gang
Created By: Tom DeFalco & Mark Bright
First Appearance: Solo Avengers #11 (1988)
Role: Jobber Villain
Group Affiliations: The Claws (his own personal gang)
PL 5 (67)
STRENGTH 2 STAMINA 2 AGILITY 4
FIGHTING 6 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 0 AWARENESS 0 PRESENCE 1

Skills:
Acrobatics 3 (+7)
Athletics 5 (+7)
Close Combat (Unarmed) 1 (+7)
Deception 2 (+3)
Expertise (Criminal) 3 (+3)
Intimidation 2 (+3)
Perception 2 (+2)
Stealth 2 (+6)

Advantages:
Equipment 2 (Bolas), Fast Grab, Improved Critical 2 (Unarmed, Claws), Ranged Attack 1, Set-Up, Teamwork

Powers:
"Bobcat Costume" (Flaws: Removable) [4]
"Claws"
Strength-Damage +2 (Feats: Split) (3)
Movement 1 (Wall-Crawling) (2)
-- (5 points)

Equipment:
"Bolas" Snare 5 (Flaws: Limited to 5 Uses) (Diminished Range -1) (9)

Offense:
Unarmed +7 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Claws +6 (+4 Damage, DC 19)
Bolas +5 (+5 Ranged Affliction, DC 15)
Initiative +4

Defenses:
Dodge +8 (DC 18), Parry +8 (DC 18), Toughness +2, Fortitude +3, Will +0

Complications:
Motivation (Greed)

Total: Abilities: 38 / Skills: 20--10 / Advantages: 8 / Powers: 4 / Defenses: 7 (67)

-Bobcat's Goons in "The Claws" are Elite Mooks of a sort- enough to be a pain in the ass (especially to a hero with Toughness 4 like Clint- five dudes attacking you at once can be REALLY bad in those cases), but not enough to be that good on their own.

[Jabroniville]

THE TRACKSUIT BROS (aka The Tracksuit Mafia, The Tracksuit Draculas)
Created By: Matt Fraction & David Aja, bro
First Appearance, Bro: Hawkeye #1 (Oct. 2012, bro)
Role, Bro: Mook Army, bro
PL 5 (38), Bro
STRENGTH, bro 1 STAMINA 3, bro AGILITY, bro 2
FIGHTING, bro 5 DEXTERITY 1, bro
INTELLIGENCE, bro 0 AWARENESS 0, bro PRESENCE, bro 0

Skills, bro:
Deception 2 (+2)
Expertise (Thug) 2 (+2)
Intimidation 4 (+4)

Advantages, bro:
Bro, Equipment 2 (Guns, bro), Ranged Attack 4, bro

Equipment, bro:
"Rifle" Blast 5 (10, bro)

Offense, bro:
Unarmed +5 (+1 Damage, DC 16)
Guns +5 (+5 Ranged Damage, DC 20)
Initiative +3

Defenses, bro:
Dodge +5 (DC 15), Parry +5 (DC 15), Toughness +3, Fortitude +3, Will +0

Complications, bro:
Motivation (Greed, bro)

Total: Abilities: 24 / Skills: 8--4 / Advantages: 6 / Powers: 0 / Defenses: 4 (38, bro)

-Hey bro, so the "Tracksuit Draculas", as they are sometimes called in Matt Fraction's Hawkeye, bro, are a gang of Adidas-wearing Eastern European hoodlums, bro. Their most notable trait aside from their distinctive dress, bro, is the fact that they constantly puncuate every sentence with the word "Bro", bro. This is something I'd passed off as just a humorous gag, bro, until I came upon some Slavic sorts at the Calgary Zoo, bro, and they indeed talked like "Hey bro, those eagles are big, bro, but it's just sitting there not doing anything, bro, bro". I mean, it was literally every fourth word, bro. Bro- I couldn't believe it! In any case, bro, these bros are led by this old bro who still talks in the same "Bro"-filled patter, and they owned the building where Clint Barton was residing, bro. But Clint futzing beat a bunch of them up and then bought the building, bro, setting the Draculas against him- ultimately bro, they hired a clown-based assassin bro after him, but Clint and Kate Bishop were able to beat him and arrest most of the Draculas, bro.

-So bro, these Tracksuit Draculas are actually somewhat potent, bro, because they're able to frequently take Clint or Kate in a 5-on-1 fight, which is typically beyond the measure of most HYDRA bros, bro. It's just Fraction's more "urban/regular guy" storytelling at work, bro, but statistically, it kinda means these Adidas-wearing bros are gonna be good enough in a fight to tackle a PL 10 Avenger and get lucky sometimes, bro.