Jab’s Builds! (Nightmare Creatures/Circus! Lawnmower Man! Metroid!)

[Jabroniville]

So I know I just talked about the difficulty of coming up with an appropriate "Posting Order" for the Marvel Family builds, but hoo boy- the WW set has been even MORE tricky!

The issue is, you have to put all the versions of WW together for the same of comparing them to each other. And you want to split up the Main Eventers (Cheetah, Circe, Ares). But then there's the B-tier threats and other recognizable names (Giganta, Dr. Poison)... and the fact that every one of these characters has multiple versions, spreading that out. All the D-tiers and jokes are fun, but you don't want to post nothing BUT that for too long, either. And hoo boy- a lot of her foes are D-tiers.

And also where to place Steve & Etta? And Tim & I-Ching? Logically Golden Age could go first, but they're big names, so I didn't wanna post them RIGHT after Diana, so I threw in the "martial arts" guys as a counterpart to the "Mod" Diana. All in all, I re-did my entire "Posting Order" list three times.

And yes, since I've not read actual comics about 90% of these guys, I'll probably be taking corrections this whole time, lol.

[Jabroniville]

STEVE TREVOR II (Silver Age)
Created By: William Moulton Marston & Harry G. Peter
First Appearance: All Star Comics #8 (Dec. 1941)
Role: The Love Interest
Group Affiliations: The U.S. Armed Forces, A.R.G.U.S., Justice League Dark
PL 7 (95)
STRENGTH 2 STAMINA 4 AGILITY 3
FIGHTING 8 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 3 PRESENCE 4

Skills:
Athletics 4 (+6)
Deception 4 (+8)
Expertise (Military) 5 (+8)
Insight 4 (+7)
Perception 4 (+7)
Stealth 2 (+5)
Technology 2 (+5)
Treatment 1 (+4)
Vehicles 4 (+8)

Advantages:
Benefit (Role- U.S. Army), Equipment 4 (Gun & Stuff), Ranged Attack 4

Offense:
Unarmed +8 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Guns +8 (+6 Ranged Damage, DC 21)
Initiative +8

Defenses:
Dodge +8 (DC 18), Parry +8 (DC 18), Toughness +4, Fortitude +5, Will +6

Complications:
Relationship (Wonder Woman)- Steve openly pines for the superheroine, ignoring the meek nurse Diana Prince. Eventually, the two were married.
Relationship (Hippolyta Trevor- Daughter)- Steve's daughter becomes the heroine Fury.
Responsibility (The U.S. Army)- Steve is an intelligence officer.

Total: Abilities: 62 / Skills: 30--15 / Advantages: 9 / Powers: 0 / Defenses: 9 (95)

-Once Marston was gone and other writers with a less feminist bent took over, Steve Trevor began to change. At times, he was noticeably threatened by his girlfriend's power, whining about it, and Diana would appear almost apologetic for emasculating him so. Attempts at the "Romance Genre" by writer-editor Robert Kanigher would have WW pine over Steve or wonder what it would be like to be married to him, and various characters would engage in "Superdickery" and cover-teases to get fans to buy the comics. By this point, we were into the Silver Age, with the "Earth-Two" Steve & Diana eventually settling down. MODERN comics writers, however, had different opinions. Things finally came to a head when Wonder Woman hit her "Mod" era as a de-powered detective- Steve was shot by a henchman of Doctor Cyber's and KILLED in 1969! And artist Mike Sekowsky bragged callously in the letter's section years later "Steve Trevor was dull and boring and I didn't like him much, so I disposed of him". So yes, this casual dismissal of longtime characters goes a LONG way back.

-The "Non-Powered Era" of Wonder Woman proved very unpopular, so she was soon back, and Steve was resurrected shortly thereafter, given the identity "Steve Howard" when Aphrodite brought him back to life. however, he was killed off AGAIN in 1978, returning only two years later via a double from an "undisclosed dimension of the Multiverse"! Finally, in 1985, writer Dan Mishkin did a full thing with these three "separate" Steves, merging them into one character. Aaaaaaaaaaaaand then continuity ended. The Crisis was rebooting various characters, including WW, so in the final issue before George Perez took over, Steve & Diana married, their relationship going back to the old days.

[drkrash]

Steve Trevor brings up an issue I'm having in my game right now. One of the female superheroes is dating a cop. The player likes getting role-playing time with her fake boyfriend, but as GM, I struggle with what to do with the cop. I can engage in all the soap opera cliches to threaten their relationship, but the truth is that the player would rather just have a happy relationship. But as a guy (and maybe this is me being old and sexist in some way), I struggle with this poor dude, who has a "heroic" career as a good cop, but who is never going to be as powerful or as heroic as his girlfriend. As a result, I often ignore or minimize the poor guy, much to my player's chagrin.

If WW was a PC, I think the GM would have a similar problem with Steve.

Chris Pine was a fine Steve and he and Gal had great chemistry. I can see why they manufactured a way to bring him back in WW84.

[Woodclaw]

Steve Trevor brings up an issue I'm having in my game right now. One of the female superheroes is dating a cop. The player likes getting role-playing time with her fake boyfriend, but as GM, I struggle with what to do with the cop. I can engage in all the soap opera cliches to threaten their relationship, but the truth is that the player would rather just have a happy relationship. But as a guy (and maybe this is me being old and sexist in some way), I struggle with this poor dude, who has a "heroic" career as a good cop, but who is never going to be as powerful or as heroic as his girlfriend. As a result, I often ignore or minimize the poor guy, much to my player's chagrin.

If WW was a PC, I think the GM would have a similar problem with Steve.

Chris Pine was a fine Steve and he and Gal had great chemistry. I can see why they manufactured a way to bring him back in WW84.

One of my favorite superhero quotes is from Iron Man #306 "Saving the world is easy. changing it for the better... that takes hard work.", which was also the underlying sentiment to the Ross/Dini World's Greatest Heroes series. This, I think is a really good dynamic for a human/superhuman relationship: superhumans can deal with big problems, save the world, stop alien invasions and be a symbol of hope, but there are still thousands upon thousands of small everyday problems that need to be addressed and here is where a normal human character must step in.
It's very much one of the ideas at the core of the Goblinslayer manga: the big heroes might go toe-to-toe with the demon lord, but someone must keep the little goblins from burning down farms and villages.

[drkrash]

This is a useful insight; thanks. Any thoughts on how to translate that to the table?

[Ares]

Steve here is an example of why I really don't consider "Women in Refrigerators" to be a thing, or at least not a sexist thing. Bad things happen to a hero's supporting cast regardless of gender, and it's a cheap source of melodrama to have the bad thing happen to the hero's significant other. And if the hero is a woman who has a long romantic history with men, bad things will happen to the men in her life. Steve here got killed TWICE (that's twice in both the comics AND the movies), and then a later boyfriend of Diana named Trevor Barnes died permanently. Same thing happened to several of Carol Danvers significant others and relatives, and to Rogue, etc.

[Ares]

This is a useful insight; thanks. Any thoughts on how to translate that to the table?

Just treat it like any situation where a guy might be in a relationship where his significant other has some kind of advantage over him, like if she were a doctor who made more money than him or some such. He has to come to terms with the fact that, despite the desire to take care of his partner, there are things she can do that he can't, and he has to take solace in the things he can do. That being with a capable partner isn't emasculating, and in fact reflects his own worth because she obviously sees something in him.

That could even be a story-arc where he has to deal with this in character, but you could maybe create a scenario where there's a crisis, and while the heroes are fighting the bad guys, the cop saves someone's life or a lot of people's lives just by directing them away, going into a building to rescue someone who was trapped, stopping someone from taking advantage of the chaos to loot, etc. Maybe make it really poignant and have him save someone who has a small child, perhaps the child in particular.

He could even have a talk with the heroine about he had felt weak around her, but the incident made him realize he still has power and the agency to do good. Not as much as his partner, but enough to save a life.

It's the old Starfish story.

An old man is walking on a beach, and he sees it's covered in starfish that have washed up on the shore. As far as his eyes can see, there's just starfish on the sands. The heat of the sun is dehydrating them, and the ones that the waves don't randomly drag back into the ocean are sure to die.

Well, the old man sees a kid running around, picking up starfish and throwing them back into the ocean. He's clearly been at it a while, but he's only made a relatively small dent in the number of starfish on the beach. The man yells at the boy, "Kid, you're never going to be able to save all, or even most of them. Why does it matter?"

The kid, who never stops, picks up a starfish and throws it into the ocean. As he reaches for the next starfish, the kid says, "It matters to that one."

It could even be kind of a sweet moment where he realizes that the heroine NEEDS someone in her life to provide her emotional support. In the same way Spider-Man was at his healthiest when he had Mary Jane to come home to, a female hero would just as easily find strength in the solid support of a good, dependable man who is there for her.

A default for a lot of men is the desire to protect and provide for the women in their lives. It can be a bit hard to deal with someone who doesn't need physical or financial protection, but knowing that you provide different kinds of support and protection is no less important. When someone has the weight of the world on their shoulders, knowing that you're there doing what you can to lift that weight off of said shoulders can mean a lot.

[Ken]

Steve Trevor brings up an issue I'm having in my game right now. One of the female superheroes is dating a cop. The player likes getting role-playing time with her fake boyfriend, but as GM, I struggle with what to do with the cop. I can engage in all the soap opera cliches to threaten their relationship, but the truth is that the player would rather just have a happy relationship. But as a guy (and maybe this is me being old and sexist in some way), I struggle with this poor dude, who has a "heroic" career as a good cop, but who is never going to be as powerful or as heroic as his girlfriend. As a result, I often ignore or minimize the poor guy, much to my player's chagrin.

Does the heroine's city have a "special crimes unit" or some other metahuman criminal task force? If it does have him volunteer for it. If it doesn't have him initiate forming it.

or

Do his superiors know he's knocking boots with the heroine? Have them make him the official liaison between the police and her team.

or

Go full tilt, have him volunteer for some kind of power armour or super soldier program, with the idea of leveling the playing field. Have it go wrong, somehow, and get the heroine's player to articulate why he doesn't need to do that. (This could backfire, if the player likes the idea of the character's boyfriend being a super).

[Goldar]

So I know I just talked about the difficulty of coming up with an appropriate "Posting Order" for the Marvel Family builds, but hoo boy- the WW set has been even MORE tricky!

And yes, since I've not read actual comics about 90% of these guys, I'll probably be taking corrections this whole time, lol.

No problem, glad to help since no one person can be expected to know everything about all characters.

I posted 2 facts re: Superwoman the other page back: 1) Her Magic Lasso 2) Her name

[Jabroniville]

STEVE TREVOR III (Post-Crisis)
Created By: William Moulton Marston & Harry G. Peter
First Appearance: All Star Comics #8 (Dec. 1941)
Role: The Love Interest
Group Affiliations: The U.S. Armed Forces, A.R.G.U.S., Justice League Dark
PL 7 (85)
STRENGTH 2 STAMINA 4 AGILITY 3
FIGHTING 4 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 3 PRESENCE 4

Skills:
Deception 4 (+8)
Expertise (Military) 5 (+8)
Insight 4 (+7)
Perception 4 (+7)
Stealth 2 (+5)
Technology 2 (+5)
Treatment 1 (+4)
Vehicles 4 (+8)

Advantages:
Benefit (Role- U.S. Army), Equipment 4 (Gun & Stuff), Ranged Attack 4

Offense:
Unarmed +4 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Guns +8 (+6 Ranged Damage, DC 21)
Initiative +8

Defenses:
Dodge +8 (DC 18), Parry +8 (DC 18), Toughness +4, Fortitude +5, Will +6

Complications:
Relationship (Etta Candy)
Responsibility (The U.S. Army)- Steve is an intelligence officer.

Total: Abilities: 54 / Skills: 26--13 / Advantages: 9 / Powers: 0 / Defenses: 9 (85)

-Steve Trevor returned in the George Perez run on Wonder Woman... but this one pretty much put an axe in the WW/Steve relationship IMMEDIATELY, by having this one appear as a much older man now married to Golden Age sidekick Etta Candy! Turns out that Steve's mother Diana Trevor was a Women Airforce Service pilot, and crash-landed on Paradise Island, giving her life in battle against some large beast, saving the Amazons' lives. Out of respect for her, the Amazons declare her an honored hero, and Queen Hippolyta names her own daughter Diana. Steve thus grows up motherless, and is manipulated by Ares into attacking the Island. He refuses at the last second and becomes an ally of WW's. That's like, his only bio in this era. Steve had thus vanished from being a major character by 1986, but has reappeared in the "New 52", again kind of de-emphasized, even as the Wonder Woman feature film brought him back by having Chris Pine ply his good looks into the roguish, secretive Steve Trevor. He proved popular enough that even DYING in that film couldn't get rid of him, as he's apparently resurrected in the upcoming Wonder Woman '84.

-Steve Trevor is overall a tough character to get a handle on, as it's pretty clear that the vast majority of the writers to work on Wonder Woman either actively despise him or have ZERO interest in touching on his relationship with Diana. Perez was so against it he ensured it wouldn't happen by making Steve OLD and then marrying him off. And thus Steve is in this weird zone where he's WW's iconic love interest, but nobody wants him to hook up with her, but every OTHER love interest is disregarded for various reasons. The obvious Superman/WW coupling is the ultimate fan dream (and several writers CLEARLY "ship" them heavily), to the point where fans often dismiss any other man as "unworthy" of Diana. Fans responded poorly to Nemesis, Trevor Barnes was discarded just as quickly, and more. So the character remains iconic, but writers don't know what the hell to do with him.

[Ken]

I thought Kal-El and Diana would make a good couple when I was ten. Of course, Lois was still the pre-Crisis Lois, and didn't seem a good match. But the older I got, the more I came to think Kal and Diana wouldn't be a good idea.

Of course, when I was a young adult, the 90s happened, and all of DC's relationships were upended. Clark and Lois became good for each other. Arthur and Mera split, Katar and Shayera, "never were". Weird.

[Jabroniville]

In this incarnation of SW, her lasso has barb-wire points and is called: The Lasso of Submission, allowing deepest secrets to be revealed!

In a new series for 2021, Superwoman looks taller and more muscular with another costume variation.

I once read that the CSA were supposed to be stronger and more powerful than the JLA and JSA from their beginning. So "Ultraman" name was chosen as being"over Superman ad made Superman's foe, while Superwoman was as strong as Superman---(while being a rogue Amazon, not a Kryptonian) who was Wonder Woman's enemy. Back in 1964, they made for scary and powerful villains indeed! The thought process was supposedly---who would be stronger than WW? Answer: a Superwoman who would naturally be on a par with Superman. They then made a male foe even stronger than Superman (which is why they needed a new adjective name. Also for how Ultraboy of the Legion could switch powers, Ultraman gained new powers he could choose to use,albeit all at once if possible and so desired.

Which version had a "Lasso of Submission"? I don't know if the CSA were supposed to be more powerful or not- was this actually shown in the stories?

[Sidney369]

Complications:
Relationship (Wonder Woman)- Steve openly pines for the superheroine, ignoring the meek nurse Diana Prince. Eventually, the two were married.
Relationship (Hippolyta Trevor- Daughter)- Steve's daughter becomes the heroine Fury.

That's complications from the Golden Age/Earth-2 version of Steve. You have them in the Pre-Crisis build too.

-Steve Trevor returned in the George Perez run on Wonder Woman... but this one pretty much put an axe in the WW/Steve relationship IMMEDIATELY, by having this one appear as a much older man now married to Golden Age sidekick Etta Candy!

If "Immediately" means 15 years later in Wonder Woman #170.

Personally, I don't mind WW and Trevor not being romantically involved since it removes the "abandons her home and culture just because she wants to be with a man" subtext that's in other versions of the origins.

[Jabroniville]

CAPTAIN WONDER (Steve Trevor's Idealized Self)
Created By: Roy Thomas & Gene Colan
First Appearance: Wonder Woman #289 (March 1982)
Role: Super-Powered Fantasy-Self, Controlled Ectoplasm
Group Affiliations: None (alliance w/ Silver Swan)
PL 14 (173)
STRENGTH 16 STAMINA 14 AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 12 DEXTERITY 3
INTELLIGENCE -- AWARENESS -- PRESENCE --

Skills:
None

Advantages:
Accurate Attack, Agile Feint, All-Out Attack, Defensive Attack, Diehard, Evasion, Extraordinary Effort, Fast Grab, Fearless, Great Endurance, Improved Critical (Unarmed) 3, Improved Disarm, Improved Grab, Improved Initiative, Improved Trip, Improvised Weapon, Interpose, Last Stand (Ignore Damage For 1 Round With HP Spent), Move-By Action, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 9, Redirect, Takedown 2

Powers:
Power Lifting 5 (50,000 tons) [5]
Flight 8 (500 mph) [16]
Immunity 1 (Aging) [1]
Senses 2 (Extended Vision & Hearing) [2]

"Magic Lasso" (Flaws: Easily Removable) [18]
"Grab Multiples" Affliction 14 (Strength & Will; Hindered & Impaired/Defenseless & Compelled) (Feats: Reversible, Tether) (Extras: Ranged, Area- 15ft. Burst +1/2) (Extras: Limited Degree, Limited to One Group of Targets, Compelled Limited to Telling the Truth) Linked to Ranged Strength 15 (29) -- (30 points)

• AE: "Single Snare" Affliction 16 (Strength & Will; Hindered & Impaired/Defenseless & Compelled) (Feats: Reversible, Tether) (Extras: Ranged, Extra Condition) (Flaws: Limited to One Target, Limited Degree, Compelled Limited to Telling the Truth) Linked to Ranged Strength 15 (26)

"Magic Bracelets" (Flaws: Removable) [22]
Deflect 12 (12)
Enhanced Dodge 2 (2)
Impervious Toughness 13 (Extras: Sustained +0) (13)
-- (27 points)

Offense:
Unarmed +12 (+16 Damage, DC 31)
Magic Lasso +12 (+14-16 Ranged Affliction, DC 24-26)
Grab Multiples +12 Area (+12 Affliction, DC 22)
Initiative +8

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (+12 Bracelets, DC 22), Parry +12 (DC 22), Toughness +14 (+8 Impervious), Fortitude +16, Will --

Complications:
None

Total: Abilities: 70 / Skills: 00--0 / Advantages: 34 / Powers: 64 / Defenses: 5 (173)

-Captain Wonder (sharing a name with a Timely Comics hero so forgotten he was made part of The Twelve) is an odd Silver Age character created when Doctor Psycho found that he could mould "Ectoplasm" into whatever he wanted. Scheming, he kidnapped Steve Trevor and extracted his own ectoplasm, turning it into Steve's idealized fantasy version of himself- Captain Wonder, a male hero with the powers of Wonder Woman. However, Psycho took control of the ectoplasmic form himself, using it to do battle with Wonder Woman. In this form, he fights WW repeatedly, even allying with the original Silver Swan, soon falling in love with her. The pair succeed in capturing Diana, but when the god Mars demands his agent, the Swan, kills the President of the United States, Steve Trevor snaps out of his sleeping spell and breaks Psycho's hold over "Captain Wonder".

-Captain Wonder appeared only once more- as an agent of The Monitor's in one of the tests he sent against Earth's superheroes in the prelude to Crisis on Infinite Earths. He teamed up with Angle Man, Silver Swan & The Cheetah against Etta Candy, whom they have mistaken for Wonder Woman somehow. Etta uses Doctor Psycho's "Ectoplasmitron" to create her OWN super-powered identity, again similar to Wonder Woman, and beats the villains.

-Captain Wonder has powers nearly identical to Wonder Woman's, but he has superior flight and might be even stronger. He also wore Bracelets, but it's not clear if they had similar powers to WW's, since nobody shot at him. He was also able to take control of both her Invisible Plane & Golden Lasso (probably a Complication for her). As more or less solidified Ectoplasm that had to be directed by others, Captain Wonder has no personality or Mental Abilities of his own, and is merely a receptacle for someone else.

[Jabroniville]

Complications:
Relationship (Wonder Woman)- Steve openly pines for the superheroine, ignoring the meek nurse Diana Prince. Eventually, the two were married.
Relationship (Hippolyta Trevor- Daughter)- Steve's daughter becomes the heroine Fury.

That's complications from the Golden Age/Earth-2 version of Steve. You have them in the Pre-Crisis build too.

-Steve Trevor returned in the George Perez run on Wonder Woman... but this one pretty much put an axe in the WW/Steve relationship IMMEDIATELY, by having this one appear as a much older man now married to Golden Age sidekick Etta Candy!

If "Immediately" means 15 years later in Wonder Woman #170.

Personally, I don't mind WW and Trevor not being romantically involved since it removes the "abandons her home and culture just because she wants to be with a man" subtext that's in other versions of the origins.

Did Steve not appear AT ALL Post-Crisis until then?