Jab’s Builds! (Miss Piggy! The Swedish Chef! Sweetums! Gonzo!)

Where in all of your character write ups will go.
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Davies
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Darla Deering! Molecule Man! Volcana! U.Nullifier!)

Post by Davies »

Sidney369 wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:08 am
And the Eternals and the Inhumans first appeared in 1940 in the same book.
... that's a retcon, squire. The characters in "Mercury in the 20th Century" were originally the Greco-Roman gods named.
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Jabroniville
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Darla Deering! Molecule Man! Volcana! U.Nullifier!)

Post by Jabroniville »

Sidney369 wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:08 am Mutants as a stand-in for minorities came latter. Originally it was a way to make origins for characters without much effort.
I wanna refute this, but it's been a while and I don't have any 1960s X-Men books handy. But I felt it was pretty clear when I was reading them. Stan has apparently confessed it was an easy way to write origins, but he's also stated that it served as a good metaphor (without necessarily alienating certain readers): https://www.history.com/news/stan-lee-x ... nspiration

Now, this wouldn't be the FIRST time Stan grabbed some credit he didn't necessarily earn, but given how he & Jack Kirby where, I can believe they'd make a go of it against bigotry and racism.
And the Eternals and the Inhumans first appeared in 1940 in the same book.
Yeah, Davies answered this, but The Eternals debuted in 1976, eleven years after The Inhumans popped up in The Fantastic Four. All "earlier Inhumans & Eternals were guys later retconned in as Eternals & Inhumans.
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Triton

Post by Jabroniville »

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Neal Adams was SO goddamned good. 60 years later and that's STILL the coolest Triton has ever looked.

TRITON
Created By:
Stan Lee & Jack Kirby
First Appearance: Fantastic Four #45 (Dec. 1965)
Role: Background Character, Weaksauce Weakness Guy
PL 10 (136)
STRENGTH
8 STAMINA 8 AGILITY 4
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 3
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 1

Skills:
Close Combat (Unarmed) 2 (+12)
Expertise (Animal Handling) 4 (+5)
Expertise (Science) 5 (+6)
Expertise (Survival) 6 (+8)
Insight 4 (+6)
Intimidation 6 (+7)
Investigation 2 (+4)
Perception 4 (+6)
Stealth 3 (+7)

Advantages:
Great Endurance, Equipment (Breathing Harness), Fast Grab, Favoured Environment (Underwater), Improved Critical (Unarmed), Power Attack, Precise Attack (Close/Concealment), Ranged Attack 7

Powers:
"Terrigen Mist-Given Powers: Underwater Lifestyle"
Immunity 3 (Drowning, Pressure, Cold) [3]
Senses 1 (Low-Light Vision) [1]
Swimming 8 (120 mph) [8]

Offense:
Unarmed +12 (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Initiative +4

Defenses:
Dodge +12 (DC 22), Parry +12 (DC 22), Toughness +8, Fortitude +8, Will +7

Complications:
Responsibility (Protect the Royal Family of Attilan)
Weakness (Pollutants & Toxins)- Inhumans cannot survive for long in Earth's atmosphere without regular applications of a Serum.
Weakness (Dry Land)- Triton requires constant submersion in water, or else he will quickly begin to die. This is way worse than even Namor's weakness- Triton cannot even breathe natural air.

Total: Abilities: 78 / Skills: 34--17 / Advantages: 14 / Powers: 12 / Defenses: 15 (136)

-Triton is kinda the one-trick pony of The Inhumans... well, a few of them are, but he REALLY defines the concept. His whole deal is being torn between life underwater and the companionship of his friends (Karnak is his brother, and the others are his family & allies). Turns out that when he was changed by the Mists, he adapted to an aquatic lifestyle... but would DIE if left on dry land with no breathing apparatus! He was as helpless on land as we were in water! In this, he sort of represents a living example of the whole "you don't always get a GOOD metamorphosis" following exposure to the Terrigen Mists- he also gives a strong element of tragedy to the team (a big Stan Lee trait in the books). His transfomation was so crippling that his parents refused to let his brother Karnak undergo Terrigenesis. In his debut, he was kind of the guy who realized the FF's morality (they saved his life when he was... wait for it... suffocating on dry land).

-Triton's limitations often limited the use of his character, too- it was an even more extreme version of the "Aquaman Problem" in SuperFriends, as Triton needed water to function. They were able to give him some play in the Sub-Mariner's featurer in the 1970s, at least. In most Inhumans stories, though, he has the least to do- he often just floats around in a chamber or something, or briefly helps out another character. A glorified backgrounder sometimes. He has a rebreather, but it gets broken so often that he ends up nearly dying in every single adventure. In War of Kings and the modern Inhumans push (where I'm most familiar with these guys), he does by far the least- in the former, he's in a spaceship full of water, running around searching for Black Bolt while others do interesting things. In modern times, he's basically semi-recognizable Wallpaper. At one point, he schemes to free Maximus from jail and force Medusa to become more warlike, and is arrested for it. He is... apparently just forgiven as he's with them in later stories. He is thought killed in Death of the Inhumans, incinerated by an explosive planted on Black Bolt, but he turns up in some stasis tank being experimented on by the Kree.

-Triton's the most unfortunate member of his team for statting purposes as well. He's just not... that GOOD at anything! He's PL 10, and an accurate-type mini-Brick that way, but his weakness is a KILLER, and he's generally not very scary or intimidating. He's like a super-lite version of Namor.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Aug 31, 2022 2:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
Shock
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Maker! Crystal! Black Bolt! Medusa!)

Post by Shock »

Here's a guy who got screwed by the Terrigen lottery. He gets adapted to only function in water and he lives on the Moon! And you thought Peter Parker had bad luck.
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Batgirl III
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Maker! Crystal! Black Bolt! Medusa!)

Post by Batgirl III »

The Inhumans tv series, seemingly desperate to come up with something for Triton to do, gave him a pair of knives and made him into some sort of superhumanly skilled knife-fighter. It was weird.
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MacynSnow
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Maker! Crystal! Black Bolt! Medusa!)

Post by MacynSnow »

Get rid of the Dry Land problem(or at least weaken it a little) and he comes across as a Slightly better themed Aquaman or a lighter version of Namor. Decent on a team...
greycrusader
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Maker! Crystal! Black Bolt! Medusa!)

Post by greycrusader »

A few thoughts:
The Inhumans are an interesting concept, with considerable potential to be mined, but NOT as superheroes; the Royal Family apparently enjoy virtually unlimited authority in a society with a strict genetically-determined caste system, who bred an actual slave race to perform arduous and dangerous physical labor. Individual members may be brave, compassionate, and honorable, but not even the acknowledged-as-noble Black Bolt show any particular interest in changing their system, unless pushed to do so by outside events.

Black Bolt and Medusa are examples 1960s Kirby character designs that work, which is crucially important in a visual medium. His "cursed" power and mute status, and her weird, exotic abilities are both immediately distinctive, and these traits likely helped ensure they got the most attention over the decades, and hence the most development personality-wise.

Crystal is honestly no more flighty, amorous, or fickle than the early Stan Lee written Susan Storm or Janet Van Dyne, but because of her exceedingly minor role she got so few appearances and story lines that she never developed much past that stage. And then she hooked up with one of the biggest jerks in the ranks of superheroes.

The TV series was well-cast, but the budget restraints REALLY hurt-the show honestly looked like a 1980s BBC production; they didn't have the money to do the FX needed for Medusa's hair, so solved the problem by removing the character's key trait. I will at least give it credit for making Maximus considerably more interesting than his comics counterpart, one of the most forgettable "master villains" in the MU.

Oh, and welcome back Skavenger!

All my best.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Darla Deering! Molecule Man! Volcana! U.Nullifier!)

Post by Grenzer »

Sidney369 wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:08 am Mutants as a stand-in for minorities came latter. Originally it was a way to make origins for characters without much effort.
I read X-Men #1 (reprinted) as a kid and clearly remember that the team had to keep their identities secret because human society would judge them for their mutant origins. The idea that mutants were a persecuted minority was there from the start, but Stan Lee did very little with it. His later claims that Professor X was inspired by MLK and Magneto by Malcolm X have to be taken with a grain of salt, but there was some level of social commentary in those early stories. It would take a later generation of writers that came of age in the 60's and 70's and had a broader view of the civil rights movement to come back and focus on it to turn the X-Men into the pathos-ridden franchise we know and love today.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Darla Deering! Molecule Man! Volcana! U.Nullifier!)

Post by MacynSnow »

Grenzer wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:52 am
Sidney369 wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:08 am Mutants as a stand-in for minorities came latter. Originally it was a way to make origins for characters without much effort.
I read X-Men #1 (reprinted) as a kid and clearly remember that the team had to keep their identities secret because human society would judge them for their mutant origins. The idea that mutants were a persecuted minority was there from the start, but Stan Lee did very little with it. His later claims that Professor X was inspired by MLK and Magneto by Malcolm X have to be taken with a grain of salt, but there was some level of social commentary in those early stories. It would take a later generation of writers that came of age in the 60's and 70's and had a broader view of the civil rights movement to come back and focus on it to turn the X-Men into the pathos-ridden franchise we know and love today.
Yeah. The Original X-Team(Cyclops Pre-Crazy phase, Non-Radioactive Marvel Girl, a Suprisingly Normal looking Beast,Chandeler Riggs Angel and Snowman Bobby Drake) was all about being Hormonal teens with the Mutant thing as more a "Changing bodies" metaphor. The Minority stuff was read into it much later....
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Batgirl III
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Maker! Crystal! Black Bolt! Medusa!)

Post by Batgirl III »

This is where the Death of the Author concept kicks in. It doesn't (entirely) matter what Stan, Jack, Chris, or any of the other authors behind the books intended... If any given reader's interpretation was that Uncanny X-Men could be applicable to race relations, women's rights, LGBT acceptable, religious intolerance, or whatever else, then that interpretation isn't necessarily wrong.
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Jabroniville
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Karnak

Post by Jabroniville »

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KARNAK
Created By:
Stan Lee & Jack Kirby
First Appearance: Fantastic Four #44 (Nov. 1965)
Role: Background Character, Wise Philosopher
PL 11 (175)
STRENGTH
8 STAMINA 8 AGILITY 6
FIGHTING 12 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 4 PRESENCE 0

Skills:
Acrobatics 2 (+8)
Deception 4 (+4)
Expertise (Animal Handling) 2 (+2)
Expertise (Arcane Lore) 2 (+5)
Expertise (Soldier) 6 (+9)
Intimidation 5 (+5)
Investigation 5 (+9)
Perception 6 (+10)
Persuasion 2 (+2)
Insight 5 (+9)
Stealth 3 (+9)

Advantages:
Accurate Attack, All-Out Attack, Assessment, Benefit 2 (Ambidexterity, Attack Instead of Deception to Feint), Improved Disarm, Improved Smash, Improved Trip, Power Attack, Ranged Attack 8, Set-Up, Takedown 2, Teamwork, Trance, Weapon Break

Powers:
"Monastery-Learned Powers: Sensing Weaknesses"
Super-Senses 5 (Detect Weakness, Ranged, Acute, Analytical) [5]

"Weakness-Finding Strike"
Remote Senses (Visual- 30 feet) 1 [2]
Strength-Damage +4 (Feats: Improved Critical 4, Penetrating 12) (Extras: Affects Others) (Quirks: Limited to When Studying For 2-5 Rounds -2, Inaccurate -1) [21]

Offense:
Unarmed +12 (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Weakness Strike +9 (+13 Damage, DC 28)
Initiative +6

Defenses:
Dodge +13 (DC 23), Parry +13 (DC 24), Toughness +8, Fortitude +9, Will +8

Complications:
Responsibility (Protect the Royal Family of Attilan)
Weakness (Pollutants & Toxins)- Inhumans cannot survive for long in Earth's atmosphere without regular applications of a Serum.

Total: Abilities: 90 / Skills: 42--21 / Advantages: 23 / Powers: 28 / Defenses: 13 (175)

Karnak- From "Big Head" Guy To Bad-Ass:
-Karnak is a pretty goofy-looking character most of the time, and this has hurt the rep of what should be one of the more legendary martial artists in comic books. I mean, Batman & Black Canary are good, and Lady Shiva is awesome, but this guy can knock The Thing on his ass, chop down brick walls with one shot, and can generally knock out ANYBODY. But that big, Ovoid-like melon of his... it's just too goofy to take seriously. And that little moustache as well- I've seen some cool pics of him by Jae Lee (who could make just about ANY idiotic character design look great) with the tattoos and such, but most of the time, he looks like a macrocephalic buffoon in a lame outfit. Thank God in modern times they've lessened that aspect of him, making him about a thousand times more believable as a threat.

-And yeah, Karnak's so bad-ass he's basically a walking plot device character. His somewhat-vague "Able to find the weakness in anything" ability is through training- he never underwent the Terrigenesis like the others- his parents feared what would happen to him after his brother Triton got hit by the Weaksauce Weakness Stick HARD during his own process. Which is really an unusually-ignored plot hook for The Inhumans- what IF Karnak underwent the process today? And he uses his kung-fu tricks rather effectively. With a bit of assessment, he can basically run up to just about anyone and nail them six ways from Sunday with a super-powerful blow. Hell, in his most insane showing EVER, he actually knocked the SILVER SURFER down with a chunk of brick (this has since gone down as one of those "They were smoking crack when writing this" instances that often get disregarded as a BIT over-the-top, alongside Cap throwing his Shield over a mile straight up, and Spider-Man beating Firelord in a fight, but still). He occasionally gets props, but his power is such a potential Game-Breaker that he never really gets used to his absolute peak.

Karnak's History:
-A bit of a "Noble Philosopher" type, Karnak is great at giving advice and being all "Uncle Iroh" and stuff. The most stoic and calm of the Inhumans, he would be the last to fight, but the first to finish it- his words carried a lot of weight to them, since he could see the flaws in any plan, and act accordingly. Though he was often hyped up (especially in BattleBoards-type stuff), his list of big wins would occasionally be quite small, and he'd just be a background guy. It got to the point where in modern times he was elevated as such by his rep that he effectively became a high-end Jobber, being taken out by guys like Iron Man like that was a cool feat.

-He was notably dead during the whole "NuHumans" thing, but in a funny twist, he found the weak point IN HELL, and burst forth from the chest of an Inhuman arsehole who was wielding the power to potentially take over the world. He has since been one of the more "out there" choices to get his own Solo Book, but as he's always been a low-tier character, and his book came alongside a billion other #1s- I said before I was not seeing a bright future for it, and sure enough, it was gone after only six issues, despite Warren Ellis being chosen to write it. He's since gone on to be a backgrounder. And it's interesting, for all his rep, the man's bio here is more focused on his POWERS AND CONCEPT than his HISTORY- he's simply just never been that important, and was just one of the guys along for the ride.

Karnak's Power:
-Karnak is a near P.C.-level PL 11 super-martial artist type with a few modifications. Kinda like the Iron Fist, he has a Penetrating Strike that can dish out tons of damage, alongside the Detect Weakness power (which is a bit esoteric, but kind of fits the various weird things he's been known to do). Said Strike also features FOUR ranks of Improved Critical, which is insane (it means 15-20 is a Crit) and probably should be kept out of players' grasp- but it's an accurate reflection of his power. He has to study the target a bit first, so he couldn't do it in the dark, or in the very first round of combat unless he'd seen the guy first, but after Round Two or so, he's good. I figure that's enough for a 2-point Drawback. He also has a little-seen ESP power that I only got by searching for Respect Threads featuring him (which is a handy way to figure out guys you haven't seen that often- Wikipedia has always been oddly low on Feats & stats), so I tossed that in. And his "Weakness-Finding" Affects Others, in that he can point out the precise areas for others to attack (this can allow some higher-end powerhouses to do a lot more damage, as even Karnak has his limits).

-Aside from the Strike, he's a standard Martial Artist with lots of Advantages (especially cap-altering ones), and an Inhuman's advanced stats (basically between Spidey & Cap). He's elite, but not a God. He mostly just slaps down Goons, and killed a Smasher from the Imperial Guard one time (but almost anyone can kill THOSE replaceable losers these days...). Oh, and he once owned Vision by vibrating his hand JUST right (a one-time thing, so not Affects Insubstantial for him). He's in the Spidey/FF class of metahumans though, that's for sure.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Aug 31, 2022 2:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Skavenger
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Maker! Crystal! Black Bolt! Medusa!)

Post by Skavenger »

Jabroniville wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 12:47 am
Skavenger wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 12:24 am In other news...great, now I have 1,636 pages to catch up on.

Aw, man! I missed out on builds for Gwenpool, Squirrel Girl, the Legion, AND the Disney Fairies?

But, but... I have opinions.
Well SHOOT- and there's Skavenger! Good to have you back :)! Boy, that's a lotta old posters returned in just a few weeks (Macyn, Batgirl & now you!). Yeah, you missed... well 4-5 years of stuff, lol. I posted my Disney Builds a couple years ago, but since BG & you were gone, I didn't get as many people remarking upon the Disney Fairies as I'd have liked! *sob*!

Thankfully the Disney stuff actually did better than they did the first time I'd posted them on the ATT all those years ago, which was delightful. I've since ported over ALMOST everything Marvel-related- Avengers, all the X-Men, just finished with the FF and a long Wonder Woman & Marvel Family set... so not TOO much to go over :).

But yeah that bit about the hair is pretty crazy.
Okay, so, last four or five years. Hmm. Finally watched Doctor Who. Got a bit burned out of the MCU with the exception of Thor 3, and overall got burned out on ... well, not comics, since there's still a few I pick up now and again in trade (Immortal Hulk, Something Is Killing The Children, Die, Unbeatable Squirrel Girl, Unbelievable Gwenpool), but just the industry as a whole. I kept getting excited for big changes that either eventually died out quickly (Marvel replacing their big 3 with Falcon, Jane Foster, and Ironheart, DC's Rebirth going back to classic cheerful comics, the fact that 5G was supposed to be a MASSIVE permanent shift in DC and got changed to just two months before it all goes back to basics) or have left me massively disappointed (constant reboots/relaunches, Brian Michael Bendis, everything happening with the X-Men right now). Plus, there's the fact that despite constantly saying they want to bring back brightness and hope and such in stories, Marvel and DC just can't help themselves and are doing the 90s Part Deux, with two massive events for Venom, everything that happened to Wally West, and that god-awful Death Metal stuff at DC, including the creation of the worst comic book character of all time, the Batman Who Laughs.

But in other news (or possibly "controversial opinions"), Frozen 2 was better than Frozen, but needed Frozen to have been first or it wouldn't have worked at all, The Vast Of Night might be one of the best movies I've seen in the past few years, Unbeatable Squirrel Girl might be one of my top five comic book runs of all time (ranking up there with Don Rosa's Scrooge McDuck, Matt Fraction's Hawkeye, and Dan Slott's Silver Surfer, amongst others), Gwenpool is an absolute delight in everything she appears in, Rick and Morty might be the worst TV show I've ever been forced to watch several episodes of, and Archie Comics has more bravery to do interesting things with their characters than either of the Big Two.

In the meantime, I'll try to be more active again, and silently wait for builds for Alan Moore's Top 10, the relaunch of Nancy, PS238, Vampirella, and... I dunno, Sunstone. :twisted:
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Black Bolt! Medusa! Gorgon! Triton! Karnak!)

Post by catsi563 »

Who shifts from "Kinda-ugly bulky dude" to "Hot Guy" as often as Gorgon does?
Bruce banner? :P
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MacynSnow
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Black Bolt! Medusa! Gorgon! Triton! Karnak!)

Post by MacynSnow »

catsi563 wrote: Wed Feb 17, 2021 6:53 am
Who shifts from "Kinda-ugly bulky dude" to "Hot Guy" as often as Gorgon does?
Bruce banner? :P
Who'd consider Bruce Banner a "Hot Guy"?
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Batgirl III
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Black Bolt! Medusa! Gorgon! Triton! Karnak!)

Post by Batgirl III »

Who shifts from "Kinda-ugly bulky dude" to "Hot Guy" as often as Gorgon does?
[/quote]

Chris Pratt?
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