Jab’s Builds! (Miss Piggy! The Swedish Chef! Sweetums! Gonzo!)

Where in all of your character write ups will go.
Jabroniville
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Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Re: The Scarlet Witch

Post by Jabroniville »

Shock wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 8:24 pm
Jabroniville wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 8:05 pm
-The two would engage in a nervous, timid flirtation for a long while, as neither had the confidence to speak of their impossible bond, and would wilt if things got too obvious. The Vision felt unworthy of her (being an artificial man), Quicksilver got pissy because he considered the Vision a "toaster", and Wanda was her usual self, but finally... love prevailed. The two formed a partnership to most of the Avengers' support, and even got MARRIED in 1975!
Can you imagine a relationship taking this long to develop in today's comics environment? It would never make it through multiple crossovers, mega-events, writer changes and editorial edicts.
There's no way they have the patience these days. One of the things I mentioned a few months back as one of the most annoying things about modern comics is that EVERYONE jumps like grasshoppers from bed to bed, hooking up some writer's weird "crack pairing" almost at random. Because creative teams are so short-lived, and BOOKS are so short-lived, writers simply create a new hook-up, have the characters suddenly start dating, and then the writer leaves and the NEXT guy pops in to create his own relationship.

This has led to bizarre situations like Rick Remender making Havok/Wasp a "One True Pairing" that was only used in his own book, and then poor Rogue & Johnny Storm bounced all over the place for years, with Rogue being attracted to DEADPOOL, then Johnny, and Johnny going from Medusa (during her split from Black Bolt) to Rogue, both hooking up in later Uncanny Avengers issues.

So the idea of this long, slow build with one creative team (Roy Thomas ruled The Avengers for ages), then being respected by the following creative team, and then the NEXT... it's almost impossible to think about. Vision & Wanda was created by Thomas, furthered by Jim Shooter (it's in the Korvac Saga), and consummated by Steve Englehart (it's a factor in West Coast Avengers and their Limited Series). It lasts for over fifteen years until John Byrne kills it, and later writers just screw around with it and never make it a thing again (oddly, they never once got back together!).
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Ares
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Vision! The Wasp III! Jocasta! Scarlet Witch!)

Post by Ares »

It's what happens when creative teams are less concerned with being custodians of characters and more interested in putting their own mark on the characters. It also shows what happens when creative teams are no longer dedicated to a book for long stretches of time. It use to be that you could expect a writer to stick with a book for 50 issues at a time, to really put the effort into getting invested in the character, establishing plots, side characters and so on. These days its an oddity if a book makes it past 10 issues, and they'll constantly reboot books with new number ones with new creative teams. There is no guiding hand, creative vision or attempts at cohesion these days. It's all "Flood the shelves" and "Do whatever".

It really does showcase how you need a solid balance between writer and editor. Too much editorial oversight and you get stuff like Countdown to Final Crisis, the Nu-52 and DC 5G. Not enough editorial oversight and you get the "Throw it at the wall" method of modern Marvel.
"My heart is as light as a child's, a feeling I'd nearly forgotten. And by helping those in need, I will be able to keep that feeling alive."
- Captain Marvel SHAZAM! : Power of Hope (2000)

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Jabroniville
Posts: 24690
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Quicksilver

Post by Jabroniville »

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Have you ever stood in the post office behind a woman with 20 packages who wants to know every single way she can send them to Africa? It drives you nuts! You think to yourself, "Why do I have to put up with this? These people are so slow, they're costing me time, and it's so damned irritating. I wish I didn't have to put up with this." Now—imagine that the entire world was like that... except for you. ... to Quicksilver, as he said in an issue of Amazing Spider-Man many, many moons ago, the rest of the world is moving in slow motion. That must really, really get on your nerves. Quicksilver lives in a world filled with people who don't know how to use cash machines, and want to know all the ways to send packages to Africa, and can never get your order right in a Burger King unless you repeat it several times. That would tend to make you feel very superior to everyone and very impatient with everyone.
-Peter David, expaining me-- I mean, Quicksilver


QUICKSILVER (Pietro Maximoff)
Created By:
Stan Lee & Jack Kirby
First Appearance: The X-Men #4 (March 1964)
Role: The Speedster, The Jerkass
Group Affiliations: The Brotherhood of Evil Mutants, The Avengers, X-Factor, The Avengers Academy
Avengers Grade: C-Level
PL 11 (160)
STRENGTH
2 STAMINA 3 AGILITY 4
FIGHTING 10/16 DEXTERITY 0
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 0

Skills:
Acrobatics 4 (+8)
Athletics 3 (+5)
Deception 8 (+8)
Expertise (Current Events) 3 (+4)
Insight 3 (+5)
Intimidation 6 (+6)
Investigation 3 (+5)
Perception 5 (+7)
Stealth 3 (+7)

Advantages:
Accurate Attack, Improved Disarm, Set-Up, Teamwork

Powers:
"Super-Speed"
Enhanced Fighting 7 [14]
Enhanced Advantages 18: Agile Feint, Defensive Attack, Defensive Roll 2, Evasion 2, Follow-Up Strike, Great Endurance, Improved Critical (Unarmed), Improved Defense, Improved Initiative 4, Power Attack, Takedown 2, Uncanny Dodge [18]
Enhanced Dodge 7 [7]
Enhanced Parry 1 [1]
"Mach 5-ish" Speed 11 (4,000 mph) [11]
Quickness 7 [7]

"Super-Speed Feats"
"Wall & Water Run" Movement 2 (Wall-Crawling, Water-Walking) (Flaws: Limited to While Running) [2]
Immunity 1 (Friction Heat) [1]
"Cyclone Suffocation" Affliction 8 (Fort; Dazed/Stunned/Incapacitated) (Extras: Area- 30ft. Burst) (16) -- [20]
  • AE: "Jetstream" Move Object 6 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Cone) (Flaws: Touch Range) (12)
  • AE: "Rapid-Punches" Strength-Damage +3 (Extras: Multiattack 5) (8)
  • AE: "Strike Everyone in Range" Strength-Damage +3 (Extras: Area- 30ft. Burst 5, Selective 5) (13)
  • AE: "Catch Projectiles" Deflect 12 (12)
Offense:
Unarmed +11 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Super-Speed +17 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Rapid-Punches +17 (+5 Damage, DC 20)
Suffocation +8 Area (+8 Affliction, DC 18)
Whirlwind Attack +5 Area (+5 Damage, DC 20)
Initiative +20

Defenses:
Dodge +8/+15 (DC 18-25), Parry +10/+17 (DC 20-27), Toughness +3 (+5 D.Roll), Fortitude +6, Will +7

Complications:
Reputation (Enormous Tool)- Pietro is a very unpleasant person to be around, even when he's a super-hero. He also does some very evil things- it was he who set of The House of M, by manipulating his sister.
Relationship (The Scarlet Witch)- Pietro is extremely overprotective of his sister, and doesn't like her hanging around with guys he doesn't approve of. It... can get creepy.
Relationship (Crystal- Ex-Wife)- Pietro married a member of the Inhuman Royal Family, but he neglected her for some Inhuman Militia because he's a tool, and so she cheated on him with A NORMAL HUMAN (the guy who sold Vision & The Scarlet Witch their house).
Relationship (Luna- Daughter)- Pietro rarely sees his human little girl, who usually stays with her mom.
Responsibility (Trapped in a Slow World)- Quicksilver is frequently annoyed by how slow everyone else around him moves. He says it's like constantly being stuck in line behind somebody who doesn't know how to use an ATM.
Secret (It Wasn't a Skrull)- Quicksilver used The Secret Invasion to blame a Skrull imposter for various illegal and immoral actions of his- only a few others know that this is a lie.
Relationship (Magneto- Father)- Quicksilver's father is the most infamous Mutant who has ever lived, and a notorious villain. Pietro was once beholden to him, but eventually rejected his father, only to fall victim to villainy's embrace himself.

Total: Abilities: 44 / Skills: 38--19 / Advantages: 4 / Powers: 81 / Defenses: 12 (160)

Quicksilver- Among the FIRST Asshole Heroes:
-Pietro's a weird thing in comics, representing Marvel's only full-fledged attempt at a super-speedster, yet he's at something like 1/200th of The Flash's capabilities, and has always been a second-stringer hero, the only one of the "New Avengers" line-up that DIDN'T go on to be a classic (Vision, Wanda & Hawkeye all made the grade from the late '60s era to become beloved long-running characters). Even his "I'm the son of Magneto" push never really amounts to much, leading to a few solo runs here and there (mostly lame or forgotten, like his post M-Day stuff), but ultimately, he's always too much of a dick to be likeable, and gets shunted to a team story here or there instead- runs in Avengers Academy and whatever the hell, arguably peaking with Peter David's X-Factor. Quicksilver's been through the ringer as a character, about half as much as his sister... which is about 20 times the amount almost any other character has been. Like Wanda, the Scarlet Witch, he was on the early Brotherhood of Evil Mutants, depicted as a somewhat unwilling villain (though much more fight-y than Wanda was), and then joined the Avengers and reformed. However, he's been all over the place since, bouncing around to whichever place he needed to be, as he was far less valuable to the Avengers overall.

-Quicksilver was only on the Brotherhood for a short while, wearing that ugly green shirt with the lightning bolt on it, and joined the "Cap's Kooky Quartet" fairly quickly, but his impatient, angry-young-man act made him a poor team player at times, often figuring HE should be the leader. As Hawkeye also specialized in being "That Guy", his role was a bit taken. Both he and his sister leave the book after Wanda is shot during a fight with Magneto, however, and they are taken by him back to one of his bases, finally realizing he's completely evil after a fight with the X-Men. The team later rejoined the Avengers when Wanda was kidnapped by Arkon, and underwent their next major stories- Roy Thomas had Wanda fall for the Vision, and Quicksilver ended up falling for Crystal of the Inhumans after she nursed him back to health following an injury against the Sentinels. This stole her away from the Human Torch (though to be fair, their coupling was ideally a "star-crossed lovers" situation), and would eventually result in the birth of a daughter. Finally, writer Bill Mantlo undid the "obvious", that the Maximoffs were the children of Magneto, and said that their parents were the Golden Age Whizzer & Miss America, with Robert "Whizzer" Frank having refused them at birth when his wife died in labor. Around this time, Pietro picks up his signature powder-blue uniform, making him one of the only heroes to dress like that.

Quicksilver Goes Crazy:
-Steve Englehart, of course, corrected this, and created the additional story that Robert's wife had died in labor, and so the cow midwife Bova (god I love comics) offered him the "orphaned" twins instead, but he rejected them. Instead, they were the children of Magda, who had fled her powerful mutant husband Magneto while pregnant, and gave birth by Mount Wundagore, soon dying to the elements. Vision and Wanda are soon engaged, with Pietro furiously disapproving, comparing the artificial man to a "toaster" and pitching a fit. This REALLY ramps up the "Pietro is an Asshole" thing which reverberates over the years. His relationship with Crystal proves a bit strained- she gives birth to their 100% human daughter Luna (OFF-PANEL, oddly- it's just revealed as having already happened), and he moves to Attilan to be with her (largely leaving the Avengers books for good as a result) and sometimes showing up in The Fantastic Four, especially when she joins to cover for a pregnant Susan Richards. However, Englehart writes Pietro as weirdly obsessed with leading some Atillan Royal Guard, and Crystal, alone and needy, hooks up with a NORMAL HUMAN- the neighbor of Vision & Wanda. Yes, Quicksilver is one of the few heroes cheated on for a John Everyman.

-Quicksilver later befuddles the Avengers when Maximus the Mad controls his mind and makes him go nuts. The Avengers are framed for treason while he beats the hell out of them (proving impossible to hold down), then arrested by Freedom Force. Only being shown images of his newborn nephews make him settle down, but he reappears in West Coast Avengers and fights the team again before finally being cured by the Inhumans. At some point in all this, he and Crystal divorce, never reconciling after her affair.

Quicksilver in X-Factor:
-Quicksilver was then one of many "Island of Misfit Toy" mutants chosen for Peter David's popular (but lower-selling X-book) X-Factor- as probably the least-used important mutant (I mean, he's the SON OF MAGNETO and by this point he'd been off a major team book for more than ten years). Here, David actually details just WHY Pietro is such a dick- in a brilliant issue where Doc Samson is sitting down with the team and investigating their mental health, Pietro bluntly confesses that he's a short-tempered asshole who has an issue with patience. And in an amazing bit of dialogue, points out that all of the "little things" that annoy regular people about each other- like idiot clerks who can't understand "Whopper. No Pickles" or can't work a cash machine- are exacerbated a hundred-fold with him, and asks him to imagine "A world where everyone you work with everywhere you go... your entire WORLD... is filled with people who can't work cash machines". This went a long way to improve the character in the minds of the fans... so of course once David was gone, Quicksilver got f'd around with again.

-During the BloodTies crossover in which Luna is threatened by Fabian Cortez for being the human granddaughter of mutant icon Magneto, Quicksilver quits the X-books as well as the Avengers- learning that Crystal is now seeing the Black Knight helps that decision. He takes Luna and actually stars in his OWN BOOK, which even in 1997 I thought was completely insane. Here, the entire thing centers around the High Evolutionary and his Knights of Wundagore, and involve fights against Magneto-worshipping Exodus and the Man-Beast. Yes, an ENTIRE BOOK centered around the Evolutionary- wonder why it only lasted 13 issues? I think half of my Wundagore builds involved characters from this series, too. Pietro is briefly powered-up with "Isotope E" and then rejoins the Avengers for Kurt Busiek's run on the book, but only as a side character in a roster that hit a peak during the "Kang War" that ended Busiek's run. However, he appears in Avengers (vs) Justice League, the huge Marvel/DC crossover, almost entirely because he's the only guy at Marvel who can really match up with The Flash. Busiek shows the obvious- that their levels are MILES apart- yet also has Flash lose power on Marvel Earth, and Pietro access the Speed Force on DC Earth.

Quicksilver As Recurring Weirdo:
-This marks the end of Pietro as a big-time hero and more as a selfish, possibly dangerous, loon, especially as Wanda goes crazy in repeated arcs, breaking up the Avengers and more. His words convince her to create the House of M reality where mutants rule. When Magneto, who rules this reality, realizes what's happened, he actually KILLS Quicksilver to prevent this "abuse" of his dream, but Wanda restores him and wipes out the powers of 98% of all mutants... including her two surviving family members. In the Limited Series Son of M, Quicksilver becomes desperate to regain his powers, using the Inhumans' Terrigen Mists to gain greater ones, and finally gets arrested. Finally, he "inexplicably" (Wikipedia's words) regains his real powers and escapes, deciding to be a hero again. He moves on to Avengers Academy as a side-character- an instructor at the school- where he gets this funny bit where it turns out that he's gotten out of jail by lying and saying a Skrull did all his evil stuff, blaming the Secret Invasion story-arc. Disbelieving this, the sociopathic Academy student Finesse blackmails him into teaching her the ways of great villains like Magneto. He later captures and tortures Loki when he discovers the God is impersonating Wanda, earning the ire of Thor, but teams with Hercules and the Mighty Avengers against the Olympus Group, where he and Kid Zeus make quick friends owing to mutual arrogance (hee). He later beats the hell out of Mister X of the Thunderbolts, as he moves too fast for X's telepathic-martial-arts powers to learn what he's about to do. He appears as a background guy in The Children's Crusade where the real Wanda is finally found. Later, the public finds out about his "Skrull lie", and he then he joins the privately-run X-Factor team for the quickly-cancelled Peter David-written series.

-Later, it's revealed that the twins are NOT Magneto's children, and instead the experiments of the High Evolutionary, and Quicksilver joins the Avengers Unity Squad. And immediately after this, and Pietro's attempts at redemption, another writer decides to have Wanda reject him during Civil War II and say his constant inability to learn from his mistakes marks him as a sociopath- the twins fight and Wanda sends him away, but they reconcile when they defeat an embodiment of Chaos and meet their birth mother before she dies. He was himself thought dead in a big Avengers arc that crossed all three books, but was quickly found trapped in another dimension.

Quicksilver Overall:
-Like his sister, Quicksilver has largely been pigeonholed as "That hero who always goes evil", but in this case, it's his general douchebag behavior (which often went so spiteful and whiny that even in the MARVEL UNIVERSE he stood out as a guy who didn't fit in with a group) that made it so easy for people to write in a "Quicksilver does something awful" arc. These ended up dogpiling very quickly, with every new writer simply ignoring the last story's "Pietro decides to do good from now on" moment and Scrubsing him back into his prior characterization. I mean, it's tough, I suppose, when the guy hasn't been an active Avenger for more than a couple of years since the 1960s- Wanda surpassed him as a character SO badly, and he just got screwed around after that point. It's odd, because I wrote him off as a "rarely used" guy, but if you see it... he was in The Avengers twice, then supported on the FF book, then a few other runs here and there, then a SOLO BOOK, then Avengers again, then played a role in several big events like House of M... it's just too bad he's always shown up by his sister, and undergoes the same stories over and over again. The nature of the medium if you're a side character who's too important to just ignore, I guess- most heroes are lucky and just go into limbo... as the son of MAGNETO, Quicksilver almost HAD to be used. And you'll note that he's been a minor nobody since THAT was written out.

-In the end, the character has fairly few fans- his appearance and powers aren't cool enough to make up for his shitty attitude (again, even by Marvel standards), which left most people cold on him- none of the kids I know liked Quicksilver, and he was always seen as annoying, dumb-looking and a jerk. And not the FUN kind, either- guys like Wildfire or Wolverine were jerks, but were at least FUNNY and flat-out aggressive bad-asses to make up for it... Quicksilver was a WHINER.

Quicksilver's Powers:
-Power-wise, Pietro's pretty easy to stat, and his powers are pretty explicitly given in the comics (Supersonic speed, but much less than the near-Light Speed Force users of DC), so he's easy there. I gave him a handful of the Alt-Effects there too, including a Cyclone Suffocation, Multiattack punches, a pushing stream, a Whirlwind Attack that hits everyone, and the ability to Deflect projectile attacks. He's not entirely efficient for his PL (Defensive Roll is much worse than Protection, and he makes PL 10.5 on offense), but he's still not someone to screw around with in combat. He's harder to hit than fricking SPIDER-MAN, who is one of the defining "hard to hit" guys in all of comics, and he gains a metric ton of Combat Advantages as a result of his Super-Speed, nearly all defensive. I actually upgraded him since 2014, figuring that I've read issues where he houses entire Avengers squads- Marvel was more clear than even DC as to what would happen if a Speedster came at you with everything he had- nobody can lay a finger on him, and he can hammer anybody.

-For some reason, DCA's Flash has crappy hand-to-hand accuracy. Well, not CRAPPY, but only +10, and this is a guy who's so fast, he can hit you before you even see him. So I gave Quicksilver some really good hand-to-hand accuracy.

---

QUICKSILVER (Pietro Maximoff)- Younger Version
Created By:
Stan Lee & Jack Kirby
First Appearance: The X-Men #4 (March 1964)
Role: The Speedster, The Jerkass
Group Affiliations: The Brotherhood of Evil Mutants, The Avengers, X-Factor, The Avengers Academy
Avengers Grade: C-Level
PL 10 (156)
STRENGTH
2 STAMINA 3 AGILITY 4
FIGHTING 10/14 DEXTERITY 0
INTELLIGENCE 1 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 0

Skills:
Acrobatics 4 (+8)
Athletics 3 (+5)
Deception 8 (+8)
Expertise (Current Events) 3 (+4)
Insight 3 (+5)
Intimidation 6 (+6)
Investigation 3 (+5)
Perception 5 (+7)
Stealth 3 (+7)

Advantages:
Accurate Attack, Improved Disarm, Set-Up, Teamwork

Powers:
"Super-Speed"
Enhanced Fighting 5 [10]
Enhanced Advantages 18: Agile Feint, Defensive Attack, Defensive Roll 2, Evasion 2, Follow-Up Strike, Great Endurance, Improved Critical (Unarmed), Improved Defense, Improved Initiative 4, Power Attack, Takedown 2, Uncanny Dodge [18]
Enhanced Dodge 7 [7]
Enhanced Parry 1 [1]
"Mach 5-ish" Speed 11 (4,000 mph) [11]
Quickness 7 [7]

"Super-Speed Feats"
"Wall & Water Run" Movement 2 (Wall-Crawling, Water-Walking) (Flaws: Limited to While Running) [2]
Immunity 1 (Friction Heat) [1]
"Cyclone Suffocation" Affliction 8 (Fort; Dazed/Stunned/Incapacitated) (Extras: Area- 30ft. Burst) (16) -- [20]
  • AE: "Jetstream" Move Object 6 (Extras: Area- 60ft. Cone) (Flaws: Touch Range) (12)
  • AE: "Rapid-Punches" Strength-Damage +3 (Extras: Multiattack 5) (8)
  • AE: "Strike Everyone in Range" Strength-Damage +3 (Extras: Area- 30ft. Burst 5, Selective 5) (13)
  • AE: "Catch Projectiles" Deflect 12 (12)
Offense:
Unarmed +11 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Super-Speed +15 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Rapid-Punches +15 (+5 Damage, DC 20)
Suffocation +8 Area (+8 Affliction, DC 18)
Whirlwind Attack +5 Area (+5 Damage, DC 20)
Initiative +20

Defenses:
Dodge +8/+15 (DC 18-25), Parry +10/+15 (DC 20-25), Toughness +3 (+5 D.Roll), Fortitude +6, Will +7

Complications:
Reputation (Enormous Tool)- Pietro is a very unpleasant person to be around, even when he's a super-hero. He also does some very evil things- it was he who set of The House of M, by manipulating his sister.
Relationship (The Scarlet Witch)- Pietro is extremely overprotective of his sister, and doesn't like her hanging around with guys he doesn't approve of. It... can get creepy.
Relationship (Crystal- Ex-Wife)- Pietro married a member of the Inhuman Royal Family, but he neglected her for some Inhuman Militia because he's a tool, and so she cheated on him with A NORMAL HUMAN (the guy who sold Vision & The Scarlet Witch their house).
Relationship (Luna- Daughter)- Pietro rarely sees his human little girl, who usually stays with her mom.
Responsibility (Trapped in a Slow World)- Quicksilver is frequently annoyed by how slow everyone else around him moves. He says it's like constantly being stuck in line behind somebody who doesn't know how to use an ATM.
Secret (It Wasn't a Skrull)- Quicksilver used The Secret Invasion to blame a Skrull imposter for various illegal and immoral actions of his- only a few others know that this is a lie.
Relationship (Magneto- Father)- Quicksilver's father is the most infamous Mutant who has ever lived, and a notorious villain. Pietro was once beholden to him, but eventually rejected his father, only to fall victim to villainy's embrace himself.

Total: Abilities: 44 / Skills: 38--19 / Advantages: 4 / Powers: 77 / Defenses: 12 (156)

-Here's the original, PL 10 build, probably suiting the character up until the 1980s.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Aug 03, 2022 12:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sidious
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Re: Quicksilver

Post by Sidious »

Jabroniville wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:53 am Have you ever stood in the post office behind a woman with 20 packages who wants to know every single way she can send them to Africa? It drives you nuts! You think to yourself, "Why do I have to put up with this? These people are so slow, they're costing me time, and it's so damned irritating. I wish I didn't have to put up with this." Now—imagine that the entire world was like that... except for you. ... to Quicksilver, as he said in an issue of Amazing Spider-Man many, many moons ago, the rest of the world is moving in slow motion. That must really, really get on your nerves. Quicksilver lives in a world filled with people who don't know how to use cash machines, and want to know all the ways to send packages to Africa, and can never get your order right in a Burger King unless you repeat it several times. That would tend to make you feel very superior to everyone and very impatient with everyone.
-Peter David, expaining me-- I mean, Quicksilver

Ah yes explaining PMS (Pietro Maximoff Syndrome). I believe this was from his time on X-Factor as the new Government Mutant team.
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Goldar
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Vision! The Wasp III! Scarlet Witch! Quicksilver!)

Post by Goldar »

Very nice Quicksilver, Jab!

I love that you included an earlier version which I was wanting!

What do you think of these Pietro Powers?
--Flight (limited); First seen around ish 44
--Ping-Ponging: First seen around ish 80 something
--Super-strength: Upper body 1000 pounds, legs 1 ton
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catsi563
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Re: Quicksilver

Post by catsi563 »

Sidious wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:41 am
Jabroniville wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:53 am Have you ever stood in the post office behind a woman with 20 packages who wants to know every single way she can send them to Africa? It drives you nuts! You think to yourself, "Why do I have to put up with this? These people are so slow, they're costing me time, and it's so damned irritating. I wish I didn't have to put up with this." Now—imagine that the entire world was like that... except for you. ... to Quicksilver, as he said in an issue of Amazing Spider-Man many, many moons ago, the rest of the world is moving in slow motion. That must really, really get on your nerves. Quicksilver lives in a world filled with people who don't know how to use cash machines, and want to know all the ways to send packages to Africa, and can never get your order right in a Burger King unless you repeat it several times. That would tend to make you feel very superior to everyone and very impatient with everyone.
-Peter David, expaining me-- I mean, Quicksilver

Ah yes explaining PMS (Pietro Maximoff Syndrome). I believe this was from his time on X-Factor as the new Government Mutant team.
exactly imagine a world where even automatic doors opening feels like it takes an eternity or where just pumping gas takes a minute but feels like a day and half of work. the psychological pressure on someone like that who doesn't have a stable foundation to begin with would drive a person insane
Dr. Silverback has wryly observed that this is like trying to teach lolcats about Shakespeare

Showdown at the Litterbox

Catsi stories
Shock
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Vision! The Wasp III! Scarlet Witch! Quicksilver!)

Post by Shock »

catsi563 wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 6:08 pm
Sidious wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:41 am
Jabroniville wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:53 am Have you ever stood in the post office behind a woman with 20 packages who wants to know every single way she can send them to Africa? It drives you nuts! You think to yourself, "Why do I have to put up with this? These people are so slow, they're costing me time, and it's so damned irritating. I wish I didn't have to put up with this." Now—imagine that the entire world was like that... except for you. ... to Quicksilver, as he said in an issue of Amazing Spider-Man many, many moons ago, the rest of the world is moving in slow motion. That must really, really get on your nerves. Quicksilver lives in a world filled with people who don't know how to use cash machines, and want to know all the ways to send packages to Africa, and can never get your order right in a Burger King unless you repeat it several times. That would tend to make you feel very superior to everyone and very impatient with everyone.
-Peter David, expaining me-- I mean, Quicksilver

Ah yes explaining PMS (Pietro Maximoff Syndrome). I believe this was from his time on X-Factor as the new Government Mutant team.
exactly imagine a world where even automatic doors opening feels like it takes an eternity or where just pumping gas takes a minute but feels like a day and half of work. the psychological pressure on someone like that who doesn't have a stable foundation to begin with would drive a person insane
Or a well-adjusted person would learn to cope. There are people who deal with worse than chronic impatience and manage to not be a jerk
greycrusader
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Vision! The Wasp III! Scarlet Witch! Quicksilver!)

Post by greycrusader »

The Vision and Scarlet Witch both suffered from MASSIVE character derailing story lines, which pushed them SO far away from the strong, likable heroes they were becoming to mentally unstable, untrustworthy, fringe players whom their own teammates can only cautiously count upon. Especially with Wanda (and her sibling Pietro), and the endless rewriting of her origin and powers. Ruining one of the rare happy superhero couples (and families with children) just about permanently tainted both heroes, since this just gets brought up again and again whenever the two are on the Avengers together. Meanwhile, the movie versions are well-received and fairly popular, maybe even breaking out moreso with the upcoming Disney Plus series.

Quicksilver got so badly "flanderized" (when ONE character trait gets incredibly emphasized over time, to the exclusion of all else); the last time he was a remotely sympathetic character, albeit still an callous jerk, was in the first Peter David X-Factor team. Right now he comes off as a third rate Sub-Mariner, a token villainous teammate, but not nearly as cool or effective. And again-BOTH movie versions were pretty well done, especially the one over in Fox's X-franchise.

There's a whole lot I think could be set right in the MU.

All my best.
Jabroniville
Posts: 24690
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Master Pandemonium

Post by Jabroniville »

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MASTER PANDEMONIUM (Martin Preston)
Created By:
Steve Englehart & Al Milgrom
First Appearance: The West Coast Avengers #4 (Jan. 1986)
Role: Evil Wizard
Group Affiliations: The Hellfire Club
PL 10 (239)
STRENGTH
2/8 STAMINA 10 AGILITY 2
FIGHTING 8 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 3 AWARENESS 1 PRESENCE 3

Skills:
Deception 3 (+6)
Expertise (Acting) 2 (+5)
Expertise (Magic) 6 (+9)
Intimidation 3 (+6)
Perception 2 (+3)
Stealth 2 (+2)

Advantages:
Ranged Attack 4, Ritualist

Powers:
Flight 4 (30 mph) [8]
"Mystical Hellfire" Blast 12 (24) -- [25]
AE: Concussive Blast 10 (Feats: Split) (21)

"Demonic Limbs"
"Demon Arms" Enhanced Strength 6 (Flaws: Limited to Arms) [6]

"Detach Limbs" Summon 5 (Feats: Mental Link) (Extras: Heroic +2, 4 Minions +4, Horde, Continuous, Variable- Demons) (Flaws: Loses Limbs as a Result) (50) -- [51]
AE: Extra Limbs 2 (2)
"Rakasha Demons" Summon 4 (Extras: 16 Minions +8, Horde, Variable- Demons) [48]

Offense:
Unarmed +8 (+2 Damage, DC 17)
Demon Arms +8 (+8 Damage, DC 23)
Blasts +8 (+10-12 Ranged Damage, DC 25-27)
Initiative +2

Defenses:
Dodge +8 (DC 18), Parry +8 (DC 18), Toughness +10, Fortitude +10, Will +6

Complications:
Motivation (Regaining Soul)- Mephisto separated Pandemonium's soul fragments from his body, and transformed them.
Responsibility (Mephisto's Slave)- Selling your soul to Mephisto is a rather crap idea, all things considered.

Total: Abilities: 66 / Skills: 18--9 / Advantages: 5 / Powers: 148 / Defenses: 11 (239)

-Master Pandemonium is the drug-addled creation of Steve Englehart as the trademark villain of his first West Coast Avengers run. He was an actor who made a deal with Mephisto to get his arm back, but instead had demons grafted to his body, making him a bit of a goof overall. He won pieces of his missing soul by absorbing the transformed fragments, an act which brought him into conflict with the West Coasters, Firebird, and the Thing. He regained a piece against the Cat People that transformed Tigra, did a thing with the Fantastic Four, and finally re-absorbed two MORE parts of his soul... the "children" of The Vision & The Scarlet Witch! However, at this point Mephisto arrived, and said that the "soul fragments" were actually pieces of HIMSELF, slivered off after Franklin Richards attacked him. This was all just a ruse to have someone else do the work for him, and he imprisoned Pandemonium back in Hell.

-His latter appearances were REALLY sporadic, as he showed up here and there in minor roles- mutated by his torture, he attacked the Scarlet Witch again, but seemingly died fighting the mysterious being that was helping him. Later, a normal-looking Pandemonium had to fight Wiccan & Speed, the reincarnations of the children Wanda had lost. The kids attacked him, but realized he was not a threat (he'd been in hiding, fearing that he was to blame for Wanda's many breakdowns). Ghost Rider later assaults him to use his chest as a portal into Hell, but a much nastier Pandemonium arrives to attack the new Caretaker and ally with Kid Blackheart and his army of demons. An army of Ghost Riders, Daimon Hellstrom & Jaine Cutter instead defeats them. His most recent appearance is largely as a gag in Wolverine & the X-Men, teaching "Hell Literature" at the Hellfire Academy. His wacky appearance and link to Wanda mean that the character is kind of a joke, especially since his debut mega-arc led to him being manipulated by Mephisto.

-Pandemonium is tricky, as like most Magic Guys, his abilities can change between appearances- I can only find ONE bio that says he's more durable than a normal guy (I don't see how a Glass Cannon could take on ANY of The Avengers, West Coast or not), and some powers were limited to temporary Devices (like Teleportation). It's a bit weird to figure out a guy who has DEMONS FOR HANDS, but basically it's either Extra Limbs (he's been seen with Demon Torsos for arms, giving him four hands instead of two) or a Summon, when the Hand Demons spring off. The Summons are generally PL 8, and can vary (some Slither, some Fly, some are faster and weaker; some probably shoot fire or something).

DEMONIC SUMMON
PL 8 (72)
STRENGTH
9 STAMINA 9 AGILITY 2
FIGHTING 7 DEXTERITY 0
INTELLIGENCE 0 AWARENESS 0 PRESENCE -2

Skills:
Expertise (Demon) 4 (+4)
Intimidation 8 (+6)

Advantages:
Fast Grab, Improved Critical (Unarmed), Improved Hold

Powers:
"Leathery Wings" Flight 5 (60 mph) (Flaws: Winged) [5]
Power-Lifting 1 (10 tons) [1]

Offense:
Unarmed +7 (+9 Damage, DC 24)
Initiative +2

Defenses:
Dodge +7 (DC 17), Parry +7 (DC 17), Toughness +9, Fortitude +9, Will +2

Total: Abilities: 50 / Skills: 12--6 / Advantages: 3 / Powers: 6 / Defenses: 7 (72)
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Aug 03, 2022 12:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Jabroniville
Posts: 24690
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Re: Jab’s Builds! (Vision! The Wasp III! Scarlet Witch! Quicksilver!)

Post by Jabroniville »

Goldar wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 2:04 pm Very nice Quicksilver, Jab!

I love that you included an earlier version which I was wanting!

What do you think of these Pietro Powers?
--Flight (limited); First seen around ish 44
--Ping-Ponging: First seen around ish 80 something
--Super-strength: Upper body 1000 pounds, legs 1 ton
Thanks! I actually had my old Pietro build at PL 10, so I just copied that one- the PL 11 version is an upgrade I just made (proof that I will actually modify old builds instead of just re-posting them unchanged, lol).

The Flight seems like a stunt, because he never did that in any of the issues I have. Maybe one of those "Namor has powers like an electric eel today" things from the sixties :).

Ping-Ponging might just be a fancy version of his "Strike Everyone in Range" thing. Just more jump-y.

I don't know about Super-Strength with his legs- has he ever shown the ability to do that before?
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Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Re: Jab’s Builds! (Vision! The Wasp III! Scarlet Witch! Quicksilver!)

Post by Jabroniville »

Shock wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 6:16 pm
catsi563 wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 6:08 pm
Sidious wrote: Fri Mar 20, 2020 11:41 am

Ah yes explaining PMS (Pietro Maximoff Syndrome). I believe this was from his time on X-Factor as the new Government Mutant team.
exactly imagine a world where even automatic doors opening feels like it takes an eternity or where just pumping gas takes a minute but feels like a day and half of work. the psychological pressure on someone like that who doesn't have a stable foundation to begin with would drive a person insane
Or a well-adjusted person would learn to cope. There are people who deal with worse than chronic impatience and manage to not be a jerk
Quicksilver has what we call something that EXPLAINS him, not something that JUSTIFIES him. He met adversity and it turned him into the prime douche of the Marvel Universe- someone so unpleasant he seemed to stand out as bad in the mentally-ill rosters of the 1960s.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Vision! The Wasp III! Scarlet Witch! Quicksilver!)

Post by Ares »

It's really a shame what happened to Vision, Wanda and Pietro. Not every superhero can be a squeaky clean boyscout, a grim, focused dark avenger or a fun everyman. You need the occasional Guy Gardner to stand next to other heroes and show that being a good person doesn't always mean being a nice person, or even someone who's easy to get along with. It's possible to be heroic and still be kind of a jerk. What's most important is that person is willing to put themselves into harms way to protect the innocent and fight greater evils. They can still be cocky, arrogant, abrasive, quick-tempered or any other number of things, but they can still be heroes if they can put all that aside to fight the good fight.

Quicksilver use to be something akin to a Magneto that had never lost his way. He was still arrogant, short-tempered and over-protective of the people he cared about, but he had the same kind of nobility Magneto has, a desire to protect "his people" from harm and to see justice was done. It's just that, unlike Magneto, Quicksilver was capable of seeing his teammates and civilians as "his people" as well, and thus would charge to protect them.

I can even see a lot of his mistakes being justified by his over-protective personality. He could do morally questionable things in the defense of his sister, daughter or father, because he placed them above his own moral code. It had the makings of a complex character who had at least a reason (if not a justification) for his impatience and personality issues.

Instead, much like Namor, Pietro has basically become someone who flip-flops between good and evil depending on the writer, history be damned.
"My heart is as light as a child's, a feeling I'd nearly forgotten. And by helping those in need, I will be able to keep that feeling alive."
- Captain Marvel SHAZAM! : Power of Hope (2000)

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Jabroniville
Posts: 24690
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Agatha Harkness

Post by Jabroniville »

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AGATHA HARKNESS
Created By:
Stan Lee & Jack Kirby
First Appearance: Fantastic Four #94 (Jan. 1970)
Role: Heroic Witch
PL 10 (146)
STRENGTH
0 STAMINA 1 AGILITY 0
FIGHTING 2 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 5 AWARENESS 5 PRESENCE 4

Skills:
Deception 4 (+8)
Expertise (Magic) 10 (+15)
Expertise (History) 5 (+10)
Insight 3 (+8)
Intimidation 2 (+6)
Perception 4 (+9)
Persuasion 2 (+6)

Advantages:
Artificer, Ranged Attack 4, Ritualist

Powers:
"Magical Might"
Senses 4 (Detect Magic- Ranged 2 & Acute) [4]

Teleport 10 (Extras: Extended, Portal +2, Accurate) (60) -- [66]
  • AE: "Astral Form" Remote Sensing 10 (Sight & Hearing) (Flaws: Physical Body is Defenseless) (20)
  • AE: "Mind-Wiping" Affliction 8 (Will; Entranced/Compelled/Transformed Memories) (Extras: Progressive +2) (24)
  • AE: "Magical Energy" Blast 11 (22)
  • AE: "Magical Wave" Damage 10 (Extras: Area- 30ft. Burst) (20)
  • AE: Illusion 10 (Vision & Hearing) (30)
  • AE: "Telepathy" Communication (Mental) 3 Linked to Mind-Reading 8 (31)
Offense:
Unarmed +2 (+0 Damage, DC 15)
Magical Wave +10 Area (+10 Damage, DC 25)
Magical Blast +8 (+11 Ranged Damage, DC 26)
Initiative +0

Defenses:
Dodge +6 (DC 16), Parry +4 (DC 14), Toughness +1, Fortitude +3, Will +8

Complications:
Relationship (Nicholas Scratch)- The evil warlock is in fact Agatha's own son from New Salem. When he "dies", she mourns him truly, despite his evil.
Weakness (Age)- As an elderly woman, Agatha tires quickly and cannot hold up to repeated strenuous activity, nor can she heal quickly.

Total: Abilities: 42 / Skills: 30--15 / Advantages: 6 / Powers: 70 / Defenses: 13 (146)

-Agatha Harkness (who apparently is the inspiration for Jack Harkness' name on Torchwood) was a Stan 'n' Jack creation for the Fantastic Four book, being the caretaker/governess of young Franklin Richards. The trick was, she was actually a WITCH, holding great magical power, as revealed when she fended off the Frightful Four by herself. She was almost immediately thrown into a story featuring her son Nicholas Scratch and Salem's Seven, and underwent a few more stories, but was largely an afterthough at Marvel save for stories involving The Scarlet Witch, whom Agatha took on as a student in the mystic arts. Marvel killed her off on two separate occasions- in the first case, she was burned at the stake by the Seven in The Vision and the Scarlet Witch, but the ensuing magical storm was harnessed by Wanda to allow herself to become pregnant with the Vision's children. She soon returned without explanation when Wanda's children were revealed as mystically-created effigies and not real children. The second time around, she was murdered by an insane Scarlet Witch, vengeful over Agatha mind-wiping her of her children's existence once more. Agatha has since appeared as a ghost, and was the omniscient narrator of The Vision's solo book in 2016. However, in a Scarlet Witch solo book, she is restored to life by the sacrifice of Wanda's birth mother, Natalya Maximoff.

-A woman far past her physical prime, Agatha is nonetheless dangerous in a fight thanks to her great Magical Power, making her PL 10 despite a frail body.

EBONY
PL 7 (100), Sidekick Rank 20
Normal Version:
PL 4-6
STRENGTH 4 STAMINA 4 AGILITY 5
FIGHTING 8 DEXTERITY 0
INTELLIGENCE -4 AWARENESS 1 PRESENCE -2

Skills:
Acrobatics 3 (+8)
Athletics 6 (+10)
Expertise (Survival) 7 (+8)
Intimidation 6 (+4)
Perception 7 (+8)
Stealth 3 (+8)

Advantages:
Accurate Attack, All-Out Attack, Chokehold, Fast Grab, Great Endurance, Improved Critical (Natural Weapons), Improved Hold, Improved Initiative, Prone Fighting, Seize Initiative, Uncanny Dodge (Hearing)

Powers:
"Housecat Form"
Morph 1 (Small Black Cat) [5]
"Small Size" Shrinking 8 (Flaws: Lowers Toughness as Well) [8]

"Animal Senses" Senses 5 (Low-Light Vision, Acute & Extended Scent, Extended & Ultra-Hearing) [5]
Speed 3 (16 mph) [3]
"Natural Weapons- Claws & Teeth" Strength-Damage +2 [2]

"Cat Agility"
"Climbing Skills" Enhanced Skills 8: Athletics 8 (+14) (Flaws: Limited to Climbing) [2]
Leaping 2 [2]

"Spotted Coat" Enhanced Skills 4: Stealth 4 (+12) (Flaws: Limited to Dense plants or undergrowth) [1]

Offense:
Unarmed +8 (+4 Damage, DC 19)
Claws & Teeth +8 (+6 Damage, DC 21)
Initiative +9

Defenses:
Dodge +8 (DC 18), Parry +8 (DC 18), Toughness +4, Fortitude +6, Will +7

Complications:
Disabled (Animal)- Cats cannot speak to humans, nor use their paws to easily manipulate objects.

Total: Abilities: 32 / Skills: 32--16 / Advantages: 11 / Powers: 28 / Defenses: 13 (100)

-Ebony is Agatha Harkness' familiar, a small black housecat who can transform into a large, dangerous Panther. This is basically a Leopard build with some Cat-Morphing thrown in (and a cheaper Shrinking, since this reduces Toughness as well as size & strength).

Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed Aug 03, 2022 12:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Davies
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Re: Agatha Harkness

Post by Davies »

Jabroniville wrote: Sat Mar 21, 2020 4:41 amMarvel killed her off on two separate occasions- in the first case, she was burned at the stake by the Seven in The Vision and the Scarlet Witch, but the ensuing magical storm was harnessed by Wanda to allow herself to become pregnant with the Vision's children. She soon returned without explanation
Not quite, but as the explanation sucked, it's not surprising that you don't recall it. When she shows up again, Hank Pym goes "Of course! It's ridiculous to think that methods used to execute supposed witches would work on a real witch!" Which, given that Agatha's death even had her noting that she'd been bound in ways that she really couldn't escape, annoyed the hell out of me when I read it, but, hey, comics everybody.
"I'm sorry. I love you. I'm not sorry I love you."
Jabroniville
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Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Re: Agatha Harkness

Post by Jabroniville »

Davies wrote: Sat Mar 21, 2020 4:52 am
Jabroniville wrote: Sat Mar 21, 2020 4:41 amMarvel killed her off on two separate occasions- in the first case, she was burned at the stake by the Seven in The Vision and the Scarlet Witch, but the ensuing magical storm was harnessed by Wanda to allow herself to become pregnant with the Vision's children. She soon returned without explanation
Not quite, but as the explanation sucked, it's not surprising that you don't recall it. When she shows up again, Hank Pym goes "Of course! It's ridiculous to think that methods used to execute supposed witches would work on a real witch!" Which, given that Agatha's death even had her noting that she'd been bound in ways that she really couldn't escape, annoyed the hell out of me when I read it, but, hey, comics everybody.
haha, that sounds dreadful, and like the writer didn't read the original story. Was it Byrne or Englehart writing that? Because if Englehart forgot his OWN plot point...
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